From: owner-deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org (deltagreen-digest) To: deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org Subject: deltagreen-digest V2 #19 Reply-To: Delta Green List Sender: owner-deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org Errors-To: owner-deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org Precedence: bulk deltagreen-digest Tuesday, August 3 1999 Volume 02 : Number 019 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 22:23:54 -0700 From: "Andy Young" Subject: Re: DG: Lewinsky Crash (clarification) > Conspiracy? Posh! > > This just goes to show you that you shouldn't try to remove stains > from your clothes while you are driving!!! > > (Although, in Lewinsky's defense, PCH is sort of "convenient" for a > quick jaunt either into or out of the Pacific) > >> > > Maybe she wasn't driving but had her head below the level of the dashboard > distracting the driver's attention from the road? Could be... I heard that Ted Kennedy was driving her home... Andy ayoung@pacifier.com http://www.pacifier.com/~ayoung ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 04:53:33 EDT From: LizardRoi@aol.com Subject: DG: Hollywood swingin' In a message dated 8/2/99 8:01:08 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Olaughing@aol.com writes: << What, are you on CRACK? All of the well-know parts of the ODYSSEY is told as a flashback--Odysseus is telling his story to Nausicaa's father (whose name escapes me at the moment). We first meet Odysseus on Calypso's island.>> Caught me. Rather than go to the translated source I got most of my mythology from Bullfinch. And, come to think of it most of the other stuff was text bookish stuff which retold the tales in a linear narrative. << BEOWULF has flashbacks, and flash-forwards, in addition to foreshadowing, and virtually any other literary device you want to name.>> Bullfinch again. I think. << Mark, I love you and respect you, but you've been in LA too long: you're starting to believe the hype. Hollywood hasn't come up with anything new and different since the camera trolley.>> The love and respect is appreciated, it makes a heartfelt DOH! that much easier. Note to self: the map is not the territory. However, the additional vocabulary cinema added to storytelling was the visual element. In order to present a flashback, I'm willing to bet that Homer had to set the scene from the get-go to get the audience on the same page. Sing, O Muse, of Odysseus, six years before He thinks of Penelope, far away The wine dark seas Lap at his sandals thalassas, thalassas or somesuch but Lang or Browning would do a quick wavy optical and show Odysseus with no gray in his hair, beardless, and Penelope appearing as SFX. As Hitchcock pointed out, the measure of a good director of the time was the number of text cards necessary for the telling of the story. Since movies were an international medium, less text meant less editing for distribution in other languages. Serial comics were appearing at about the same time, so perhaps much of the visual storytelling style originated with that medium. What is a storyboard but the comic adaption of a movie that hasn't been made yet? The significance of Hollywood is not to be found in the sciences of cinema. Movies are only the medium. Hollywood is something else entirely. Hollywood is what Stanley Kubrick had to keep a continent and an ocean away from him. Hollywood is a blockbuster that doesn't make a profit. Hollywood is what all the best looking girls from around the country move to. Hollywood is every movie having a soundtrack album. Hollywood is product placement. Hollywood is people who are famous for being celebrities. Hollywood is people spending literally millions of dollars on a massive project that anyone on this list knows will stink on ice. Hollywood is that fragrant bolus making a profit on video. Hollywood is people asking a movie star for their opinions about important subjects. Hollywood is magazines and TV shows showing us what the movie star said. Hollywood is Mickey Mouse being recognized everywhere. Hollywood is a president saying "make my day." Hollywood is that same fella selling a project by calling it Star Wars. Hollywood is what Americans and everyone else in the world has in common. There is possibly nothing new under the Southern California sun, but they process and package the same old shit more effectively (often in spite of themselves) than any other force in human history. Mark McFadden More people watch the Academy Awards than any other televised program anywhere. And that includes the World Cup. Do you remember when Richard Gere asked everyone in the television audience to think good things for Tibet? Imagine if everyone did. Well, imagine instead that he asked everyone to repeat after him "Ia! Fthagn! Ia! Tekeli-li!" or somesuch. Gerbil jokes are optional. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 04:53:35 EDT From: LizardRoi@aol.com Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! In a message dated 8/2/99 8:02:52 PM Pacific Daylight Time, ft203004@fsinet.or.jp writes: << True, they might have been smoking some of it, but at the time hemp for rope was an important cash crop. I think to project much more meaning to such letters than that is wishful thinking on the part of the pro-marijauna folks. >> Yes, but rope-making doesn't entail the careful separation of males from females, as Washington wrote his gardener to do. Rope utilizes the stalks of the hemp plant, so you would want the hardy leafy tall plants such as the ones I saw in Nebraska. Further, you would want to mix males and females to get lots of seeds for the next crop. But Washington's instructions were for separating males and females. This was to keep the flowers from getting inseminated, producing big buds and no seeds (sinsemilla). Seeds were at such a premium due to this practice that Washington constantly reminded his gardener to save whatever seeds he found. He and Jefferson would trade seeds, Washington was particularly taken with some India hemp that Jefferson provided seeds for. He called the resulting product "a wonder." But, I have to concede that the quotations I've seen were at second hand. I have not read Washington's correspondence for myself. But consider this: it wasn't a particularly noteworthy vice at the time. If anyone is responsible for any revisionist history, I think the drug warriors have pretty much cornered the market. Does anyone else detect a little desperation in trying to "prove" that Washington *didn't* smoke hemp? Why wouldn't he? It's a plant, it's fun to smoke and there were no laws or taboos against it. His gums hurt, cut him some Slack, he had a prescription. I was reading an old Time magazine article that addressed the boomer issue, what do you tell your kids about your own teenage drug use? Since they were having a hard time showing any physical or neurological damage caused by toking, they were reduced to citing the emotional damage caused by being stoned and failing to interact with their peers. They cited shyness, furtiveness (due to concealing criminal activity) and a sort of guilty malaise. I had an epiphany. "That's what you said would result from masturbation, you silly twits!" ObDG: The drug wars aren't about drugs, they are about control. Declare something illegal and you make instant criminals. Guilty people are easy to control; all you have to do is act like you are going to look closer if they step out of line. In real life, it probably wasn't planned that way, it's just a happy bit of serendipity for the career bureaucrats. But it is such a basic ploy in the tactics of control that most power brokers spontaneously generate some form of it. So they forbid the things we would naturally do (every culture has found something to get high on) and control us by offering or withholding forgiveness for our very nature. We're in Kafka country. And it's quiet. Too quiet. Mark McFadden I learned about "hemp' cultivation when I ran a pizza parlor after college in Sonoma County. That's right next to Humboldt County, where much of the best smoke in the world comes from. There are tales of lost communes living in the mountains and growing crops to trade for batteries and such. They defend themselves with bows and arrows and have had tribal wars over cropland. During the harvest old VW microbuses full of extras for Paint Your Wagon would come down from the mountains. The first thing they wanted from civilization was a pizza. Then, feeling expansive over draft beer, they would happily answer any questions I had for them. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Aug 1999 12:02:24 BST From: "Jacob Busby Bsc." Subject: DG: Herbs and suchlike From: Jacob Busby, IT Consultant, Tech Futures, IT Data Centre, Hampshire County Council, The Castle, Winchester. Tel: (01962) 845375 Considering all the discussion on illicit herbal substance recently I recommend that Keepers seeking to add herbs and spices to their campaign check out... http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/8017/herb5.txt WARNING. This file is v. large. Whilst obviously written with AD&D in mind, any decent Keeper should be able to switch the system with ease. The site is a collection of herbs and their effects, including seasonal availability, skill level to identify, rarity, uses and physical description. It contains herbs from both real-life and ficticious sources but a useful appendix at the end of the document lists which are which. _________ I think that I shall never see /__ __/ /__ a billboard lovely as a tree. __/ / / . / /___/ /____/ Ogden Nash, Song of the open road ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 09:48:37 EDT From: Olaughing@aol.com Subject: DG: Re: deltagreen-digest V2 #17 > Because we tell stories in new ways now. Does anyone remember a flashback > sequence in the tales of the Brothers Grimm? Hans Christian Anderson? How > about Greek, Norse, Christian yada yada mythology? Everything is told in a > linear manner, one thing happens after another. The original movies were > essentially filmed stage plays, the camera was static and framed like a > proscenium. What, are you on CRACK? All of the well-know parts of the ODYSSEY is told as a flashback--Odysseus is telling his story to Nausicaa's father (whose name escapes me at the moment). We first meet Odysseus on Calypso's island. BEOWULF has flashbacks, and flash-forwards, in addition to foreshadowing, and virtually any other literary device you want to name. There is a significant amount of crosscutting in The ODYSSEY, we follow the action of Telemachus for several chapters, and then we are told about Odysseus for a time, then move back to Telemachus. Mark, I love you and respect you, but you've been in LA too long: you're starting to believe the hype. Hollywood hasn't come up with anything new and different since the camera trolley. In addition: DRACULA is but one of a LONG line of epistulatory novels, made popular by Samuel Richardson's PAMELA and CLARISSA HARLOWE in the 18th century. The epistulatory novel has fallen out of fashion, because one cannot employ certain literary techniques and inner dialog . REDG: I think it may be time to employ more of these techniques in our role-playing. The flashback seldom is used, except as a narrative device. What about creating memories by having the players actually role-play them out? This is more work for the GM, certainly, as you can never be certain what the players are going to do, but I think that the rewards would definitely offset the bother, if used in moderation. What about having real e-mail correspondents for your players to send or receive reports or letters from? Again, the person would be out of the GM's control, but at the same time, the information sent would be of a different flavor than something the GM created. Obviously, it would have to be someone the Keeper trusted... Someone knowledgeable, but not too much so. Like anyone on this list. John Goodrich With a master's in education, and working on his novel. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 10:05:28 -0400 From: becole@juno.com Subject: Re: DG: Just plain mad! On Tue, 3 Aug 1999 04:53:35 EDT LizardRoi@aol.com writes: > If anyone is responsible for any revisionist history, I think the drug warriors have pretty >much cornered the market. First off, I will loudly pronounce that this diatribe (while hopefully relevant) is not targeted against anyone.....secondly, being adults (legal and otherwise) everyone has a right to make their own decisions. People have died to insure that freedom (although I agree it is being infringed upon in many guises). Okay, to start with, the phrase "revisionist history" applies to every damn text book or documentary or lecture that you have ever heard. Anyone, and I mean everyone, who looks back at an event and makes the mental acrobatics to catalogue, interpret, rationalise, and then disseminate that event is putting their own spin onto it. I don't care if it is Americans teaching American history, or Europeans teaching American history. By our nature, we as humans are too emotionally attached to our opinions and self-styled, self-promoted individualism to objectively interpret any historical event, much less the present reality (please note the use of the word "history" here indicates human history). We have time and again proven our incapability of doing it . We devise things like gun control and drug wars to preserve a culture (our youth) who have no capability (emotionally or mentally) or care to reciprocate that attention back to the society or the world. Instead of raising our young to create history, we are creating history to raise our young. Our schools, our institutions, our media, all revise history on a daily basis.....Novus Ordo Seclorum Baby! Line right up to the trough and munch with the herd. The herd, whether MJ-12 led, Mi-Go led, or Republican/Democrat led, buys into and is bought every day for the price of a thirty minute newscast. A whore is more expensive. But that is a singular part of the enslavement. Which leads me to where I was headed. Drugs are slavery. Alcohol, Marijuania, television, the internet, caffeine, McDonalds, cocaine, you name it, anything that caters to the "highly developed" sensors in the brain. The brain is not sitting around one day, bored for lack of stimulation (a common problem in the United States), and then suddenly proposes "Hey, let's get high!" These values are transmitted by the society, or the herd, at large. What the discovery of hemp, or opium, or cocaine did, was to allow a societal recognition of a new form of mental "stimulation". I recommend use of that word in a drug context sparingly, having lived with a good friend who grew in our house, as well as shared freely the results of his green thumb. There is nothing natural with regard to human beings about smoking hemp or marijuania. The only "natural" that plays into it is Nature, from which it came. We evolved / were designed with specialized sets of chemical receptors. There are no chemcial receptors in the lungs that would lead one to believe that we were evolved / created to inhale smoke of any sort. I guess I should just come out and say that I had numerous arguments with my housemate/friend concerning the pros and cons of this whole situation, and while I understand that it, among hundreds of other issues, is still a question unresolved in our society today, I really would hate to see a spillover into the list about something which so fundamentally betrays the ideas of Delta Green. Freedom, at whatever cost, means that we must remain ever-vigilant against tyrants and those who would enslave the human race for their own will...... Personally I think that means also making sure, as supported by the Neitzsche (sp?) view or corruption through war, that we do not enslave ourselves...... Finally, as a relevant Delta Green tie-in....Agent X, from Cell Y, has been with our cause for some time now, but recently his/her work has begun to falter. Initial reports indicate this agent could be responsible for several leaks in the past...but nothing definite has presented itself. The players are forced to investigate this agent, looking for proof of corruption or betrayal. As it will turn out through the course of the investigation, Agent X is, in reality, dying of cancer. This agent has recently acquired a nasty heroin habit to help take the edge off of the pain and continue trying to serve Delta Green. The problem is, the heroin is normal (as much as can be expected), the dealer is normal, but the agent is under surveillance by NRO/MJ-12. They have not acted yet, but poor Agent X has become so oblivious through pain/shooting up, that he/she does not notice their surveillance....but the players will. What if Agent X was a mentor to one of the players characters? What if that PC knows about Agent X's cancer? And how will everyone respond when they see NRO/MJ-12 out in the light of day keeping tabs on this ultra-secret DG operative? Has he already been bought? Is it a trap? Will I ever end a sentence without a question mark? ? -B ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 10:17:30 -0400 From: Jeff Ewing Subject: Re: DG: Hollywood swingin' LizardRoi@aol.com wrote: > The significance of Hollywood is not to be found in the sciences of cinema. > Movies are only the medium. Hollywood is something else entirely. Anaphora is one of the devices of classical rhetoric. Anaphora is handy for making a point and making it stick in the mind. Anaphora was beloved by radio genii like FDR. Anaphora is not a visual tactic. Anaphora is an aural/textual tactic. Anaphora is not learned from Bullfinch, despite assertions to the contrary. Anaphora about drugs and movies is going to get us all smacked down. But quick like a bunny before this happens: In another post, Mark, you asserted that: "rope-making doesn't entail the careful separation of males from females, as Washington wrote his gardener to do. Rope utilizes the stalks of the hemp plant, so you would want the hardy leafy tall plant" But in order to get the desired hardy leafy tallness, you selectively breed, ie, segregate the useless short plants and prevent them from fertilizing. OTOH, I'd be amazed if an enquiring mind like Jefferson's didn't think to smoke some of the hemp crop. The real DG item here, to my mind, is your story about Humboldt County. Eremitic fertility worshipping groups isolated in the Libertarian low population density, helicopter overflown counties of the Republic, fighting with bows and arrows? Anyone who can't cobble up a scenario from this is not trying. Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 10:48:02 EDT From: ScottSaylo@aol.com Subject: Re: DG: Hollywood swingin' In a message dated 8/3/99 9:23:30 AM EST, ewing@postbox.csi.cuny.edu writes: << The real DG item here, to my mind, is your story about Humboldt County. Eremitic fertility worshipping groups isolated in the Libertarian low population density, helicopter overflown counties of the Republic, fighting with bows and arrows? Anyone who can't cobble up a scenario from this is not trying. >> Or even more easily - the Rastafari. Was haille Selassie or his father Nyarlathotep in disguise? Or was some unknown Rastafilosopher who was the recipient of the Dark God's sense of humor and the creator of this bizarre cult. Tcho-Tcho connections? Look to the Future tie-ins? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 16:57:43 +0200 From: Davide Mana Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! Greetings. Before slandering poor Holmes (actually a very nice chap, victim of an unreliable biographer), Graeme wrote.... >Ditto opium. Having hooked a fair proportion of the chinese population on >the stuff in the 1880s, the number of opium dens in the Limehouse (large >oriental immigrant population) area of London in the 1880's-90's was pretty >high (Ha-ha! The Punmeister strikes again!). "Opium dens" reminds me of Fu Manchu (another overly nice chap, in his own oriental way). Keep in mind that there was a lot of laudanum going around. And that opium was introduced in the 1880s (IIRC) as an ingredient of some "special" beers. It was either added in the brewing processes (better stay upwind to the smokestacks) or added in "lumps" to the beer at the moment of serving. Not exactly XXXX. Davide Mana ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 17:38:16 +0200 From: EHuelshoff@t-online.de (Eckhard Huelshoff) Subject: Re: DG: Just plain mad! becole@juno.com schrieb: [ snip ] The only "natural" that plays into it is Nature, from which > it came. We evolved / were designed with specialized sets of chemical > receptors. There are no chemcial receptors in the lungs that would lead > one to believe that we were evolved / created to inhale smoke of any > sort. But obviously there are chemical receptors in our brains that do react to certain substances. And then there are plants that produce these substances. Therefore one could argue that it is somehow "natural". One might even think that nature, god, the outer gods did that on purpose. ECKHARD ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 17:38:17 +0200 From: EHuelshoff@t-online.de (Eckhard Huelshoff) Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! ScottSaylo@aol.com schrieb: [ snip ] > > Actually it was a little later, historically, that opium addiction became a > badge of 'sensitivity, artistic temperment and eccentricity". The age of > Byron, Coleridge, Poe and romantic young men burning themselves up in > drug-assisted ennui was 1810-1870 or so. > > Speaking of Byron and Cthulhuesque stroy-lines: here's another great book Tim > Powers "The Power of Her Regard". It has Byron as a hag-ridden character. The > characters are the objects of love of "vampires". These vampires have nothing > to do with the Stokeresque overview of the species, they are mineral > intelligence kept alive and able to interact with humans by an unholy > alliance with their "God". Very powerful writing and the characters are > terrific. The author also wrote "On Stranger Tides" a book about a Cthulian > kind of Voudon and 18th century pirates including Edward Teach and his > cronies, again powerful writing showing the conspiratorial twist to what we > thought was history. And for the lovers of Arthurian stoies (again a strange > twist) try "The Drawing of the Dark" which has a reincarnated Arthur very > begrudgingly saving western civilization under the guidance of Merlin in the > 1470's at the siege of Vienna. Great books by a great author. One that definitely fits into this company of drug inspired poets of that era is the unfortunately not too well known Irish poet James Clarence Mangan [1803 - 1849 ]. Some of his poems may also be considered "cthulhuesque". For example "The Nameless One": "[ ...] Tell how this Nameless, condem'd for years long To herd with demons from hell beneath, Saw things that made him, with groans and tears, Long for even death" ECKHARD ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 17:38:17 +0200 From: EHuelshoff@t-online.de (Eckhard Huelshoff) Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! LizardRoi@aol.com schrieb: [ snip ] > ObDG: The drug wars aren't about drugs, they are about control. Declare > something illegal and you make instant criminals. Guilty people are easy to > control; all you have to do is act like you are going to look closer if they > step out of line. In real life, it probably wasn't planned that way, it's > just a happy bit of serendipity for the career bureaucrats. But it is such a > basic ploy in the tactics of control that most power brokers spontaneously > generate some form of it. > So they forbid the things we would naturally do (every culture has found > something to get high on) and control us by offering or withholding > forgiveness for our very nature. You're right: "every culture has found something to get high on" These are the drugs that are considered legal, it's the ones that come from somewhere else that are made illegal. Therefore the drug wars are not only about control, they are also about xenophobia. ECKHARD ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 11:41:55 EDT From: ScottSaylo@aol.com Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! In a message dated 8/3/99 10:02:43 AM EST, doctor.dee@iol.it writes: << "Opium dens" reminds me of Fu Manchu (another overly nice chap, in his own oriental way). Keep in mind that there was a lot of laudanum going around. And that opium was introduced in the 1880s (IIRC) as an ingredient of some >> In London opium was generally available in lumps of opium gum, but easiest for administration was laudanum a "tincture" of medicinal alcohol and opium gum, strained, botled and sold as an over the counter rememdy for almost anything. Besides its truly notable analgesic quality, it was a sovereign treatment for cholera as opium quieted cramps and constipated so it saved a lot of lives usually lost from dysentery. However it was wide open to abuse. Other substances abused in the era: cocaine, marijuana, alcohol (although no one called it abuse in those days), bella donna, and arsenic ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 08:49:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Pencis Subject: DG: definite mythos stirrings in Tanzania Clipped from Yahoo (Reuters) news of the wierd Cult of the bloody tongue at work again? Tanzanians Kill 350 Suspected Witches In 18 Months DAR ES SALAAM, Tanzania (Reuters) - More than 350 people have been killed by angry villagers in Tanzania in the past year and a half after being accused of being witches or wizards, a police report said Tuesday. The killings, which took place between January 1998 and May this year, mean that an average of 21 murders a month are linked to superstition, said the report by Tanzania's Criminal Investigation Department. ``The murdered people, most of whom were old men and women, were killed by villagers who accused them of practicing witchcraft on them by allegedly killing their loved ones or inflicting curses which made them fail in business or reduced their harvests,'' said police sources. Witchcraft murders have been reported recently in Mbeya, southern Tanzania, linked to a cross-border trade in human skin. The skin is supposed to protect homes from demons and evil spirits and, when used in certain rituals, to increase harvests and lure clients to bars and shops. Some old women whose eyes had turned red after years of cooking in the smoke-filled kitchens of their huts were also accused of being witches and murdered, the report said. The report said 256 of the killings took place last year and 101 from January to May, a total of 357. Deaths were reported in 14 regions including Zanzibar. _____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 17:55:52 +0200 From: EHuelshoff@t-online.de (Eckhard Huelshoff) Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! Davide Mana schrieb: [ snip ] > Keep in mind that there was a lot of laudanum going around. > And that opium was introduced in the 1880s (IIRC) as an ingredient of some > "special" beers. It was either added in the brewing processes (better stay > upwind to the smokestacks) or added in "lumps" to the beer at the moment of > serving. [ snip ] And don't forget that Irish stuff called poteen or poitin which seemed to be around in huge quantities around that time. BTW: Isn't it strange that while many writers that wrote stuff that is inspirational for DG or CoC purposes were "at least" alcoholics, while good old HPL's only vice seems to have been sugar abuse? ECKHARD "Last night as I dreaming my way across the sea James Mangan brought me comfort with laudanum and poitin" The Snake with Eyes of Garnet - S. MAcGowan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 12:24:43 -0400 From: BRUCE BALLON Subject: Re: DG: Just plain mad! -Reply Didn't the mi-go tamper a bit with human DNA, spliced in the Cocaine recepter, then went about cultivating large amoutns of the stuff all over the Andes? Those rascally fungoids.... they are clever, ain't they? Bruce >>> Eckhard Huelshoff 08/03/99 11:38am >>> becole@juno.com schrieb: [ snip ] The only "natural" that plays into it is Nature, from which > it came. We evolved / were designed with specialized sets of chemical > receptors. There are no chemcial receptors in the lungs that would lead > one to believe that we were evolved / created to inhale smoke of any > sort. But obviously there are chemical receptors in our brains that do react to certain substances. And then there are plants that produce these substances. Therefore one could argue that it is somehow "natural". One might even think that nature, god, the outer gods did that on purpose. ECKHARD ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 12:28:36 -0400 From: BRUCE BALLON Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! -Reply >>> 08/03/99 11:41am >>> Other substances abused in the era: cocaine, marijuana, alcohol (although no one called it abuse in those days), bella donna, and arsenic Also a substance I like throwing into the Victorian era is the liquor Absinthe. Outlawed now for more than 8 decades, it is finally coming back in Europe. Used to cause the 'Green Muses' for poets.. i.e. after drinking the emerald alcoholic beverage, most people ended up with alcohol intoxication and deliriums.... Anyone over there in Europe try it? Bruce ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 12:50:54 EDT From: ScottSaylo@aol.com Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! -Reply In a message dated 8/3/99 11:27:39 AM EST, BBALLON@arf.org writes: << wed now for more than 8 decades, it is finally coming back in Europe. Used to cause the 'Green Muses' for poets.. i.e. after drinking the emerald alcoholic beverage, most people ended up with alcohol intoxication and deliriums.... >> Absinthe a thickish emerald green liquid was poured into Pernot and drunk while the green clouds swirled in the water. Absinthe is a variety of anisette whose distillation is all but a lost art. It is illegal to make, an art that may go back to ancient Pictish peoples (Picardy), The Celts knew how to make it and may have reserved it for ceremonial pruposes. Anyone who offers to sell it to you today is probably selling you anisette with a little green food coloring. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 12:59:10 -0400 From: BRUCE BALLON Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! -Reply -Reply OOops...sorry I meant outlaed in the states ;). Actaully, I think I hear it is in the states. I heard a few weird medical reports regarding it in SF. Lovvve that wormwood. Bruce >>> BRUCE BALLON 08/03/99 12:28pm >>> >>> 08/03/99 11:41am >>> Other substances abused in the era: cocaine, marijuana, alcohol (although no one called it abuse in those days), bella donna, and arsenic Also a substance I like throwing into the Victorian era is the liquor Absinthe. Outlawed now for more than 8 decades, it is finally coming back in Europe. Used to cause the 'Green Muses' for poets.. i.e. after drinking the emerald alcoholic beverage, most people ended up with alcohol intoxication and deliriums.... Anyone over there in Europe try it? Bruce ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 10:08:52 -0700 From: Phil A Posehn Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! For what it's worth I can give partial validation to the Washington story, but can no longer cite sources. I did an article on hemp a few years ago and remember finding out that Washington REQUIRED a perecentage of land to grow hemp. This was most likely for industrial purposes a the prime source of rope and paper. Please also note that the original Levis were hemp. Phil Posehn > >From: : >> Washington and Jefferson maintained a spirited correspondence upon >the >best >> ways to grow "indian hemp" Since there discussion goes heavily into >cross >> fertilization and drying procedures, they were NOT braiding rope or >making >> welcome mats, for their neighbors - they probably were _(ominous >minor >chord >> in background) SMOKING it. > >I've heard that from many sources, but I'm worried that this may have >been >just a self-perpetuating rumor (although I certainly HOPE it's true). >When I >was teaching Freshman Composition (in Austin), about 20% of my >students >every year wanted to write papers on the Mary Jane issue, and they >always >quoted this from the same (perhaps unreliable) sources, like /The >Emperor's >New Clothes/ and such--usually 20-year-old books written from highly >slanted >viewpoints. So your assignment, Mr. Saylor, is to check the original >source >material and confirm or deny. We need PROOF! > >From: Phil A Posehn: >> One of the undeniable effects of the War on Drugs is the creation of >a >> rapidly growing private corrections industry. Suppose this company >is >> actually controlled by the Karotechia and is using convict slave >labor >> for its own evil ends? > >Absolutely! Paradoxically, Pot-head Central (Austin) is in the US >state with >the greatest number of prisons and the greatest number of executions. >Texas >has more prisoners than many small nations have citizens. It's one of >our >major industries, and we have very draconian drug policies to make >sure the >industry never suffers. Texas is also a major center for the KKK and >other >hate groups. (Austin is a laid-back island in a sea of rigid >intolerance--or >at least it likes to think of itself as such. It's changing rapidly.) > >From: Eckhard Huelshoff: >> Now THAT's interesting. I never ever read anything about Washington >and >>Jefferson being friends of dope. [ Does anyone of them have Dutch >ancestors? ] >> Probably the guys should have mentioned their favourite pasttime >somewhere >in >the declaration of independence. > >Actually, the Declaration of Independence is printed on hemp paper. >And hemp >was widely grown in the Colonies--in fact, in at least one of them, it >was >/required/ because it was so needed by the shipping industry for rope >and >sailcloth. > >> It really is kind of strange that the country these men were fathers >to is >now >> pumping billion after billion of Dollars into the war on drugs and >does >even >> consider boozing in public to be a bad bad thing. > >Call it the Puritan Paradox. And Big Business had a lot to do with it >(see >below). > >From: gable: >> Heh. And I thought Slater made up that part of DAZED AND CONFUSED... > >Filmed in Austin "Slacker" Texas, BTW! > >From: : >> This would have made William Randolph Hearst's wood pulp/paper >investments >>(which had helped >> his profitability in producing newspapers) moribund. Hemp is really >and >truly >> that much better all the way around as a source of paper. So, he >declared >war >> on hemp. This war is even better than the one with Spain he slapped >together >> to sell papers. > >The whole Hearst war on weed reeks of conspiracy theory. Could Hearst >have >been subverted by NWI? Or were they just allies of convenience? But >yes, it >must be stated clearly: Marijuana is illegal in the USA today >primarily >because a news baron saw his profits threatened. And it became illegal >in >many other countries subsequent to that due to US pressure. All the >"Reefer >Madness" propaganda originated with Hearst's desire to protect his >profits. >Only now, after more than 60 years, are scientists being allowed to >conduct >serious inquiry into how dangerous / healthy marijuana really is. And >we're >only just now beginning to hear in the news about all the possible >industrial applications (cloth, paper, fuel, medicine, makeup) for >hemp, >most of which were well-known a century ago but were somehow >forgotten. Did >someone say the Dark Ages were over? > >From: Eckhard Huelshoff: >> This leads to something that can or rather might be usable for >DG-purposes: >> What are the reasons for societies to declare on drug illegal [ like >dope ] and >> on the other hand celebrate another drug as a cultural heritage? >> In most western societies it's the hallucinogenic [ sp? ] substances >that >are >> banned, while alcohol plays a major role in every event. Is it the >governments' >> fear that you might SEE the TRUTH when dropping acid....? > >Doesn't alcohol cause the brain to become less active, while >hallucinogens >(yes, your spelling was correct) activate normally-unused areas of the >brain? In which case we see easily why Those in Power favor alcohol >over >certain other drugs. And take a look at the Native American >Church--members >can use peyote (only in ritual, however, which insures that it's used >only >to "SEE the TRUTH" rather than for recreational purposes which could >lead to >pleasure-enslavement) but cannot drink alcohol. There are many >revolutionary >religions that have banned alcohol. > >And for the whole issue of LSD, please take a look at >http://www.disinfo.com/ >for "FBI AND MEDIA KICK A MAN WHILE HE'S DEAD: An Open Letter from the >Friends of Timothy Leary." What the US gubmint did to Tim Leary (for >doing >nothing more, really, than using his freedom of speech) definitely >qualifies >him for DG Friendly status--he HAD to have been on to something for >them to >have smeared him so badly, violating his human and Constitutional >rights in >the most blatant manner. Too bad he sent some of his ashes into >space--we >could have resurrected him. (Ye liveliestte awefullness of Timothy >Leary is >too scary to imagine.) > >From: Graeme Price: >> Ditto opium. Having hooked a fair proportion of the chinese >population on >> the stuff in the 1880s > >Which was, again, government policy. When I first heard the rumors >that the >CIA was involved in distributing crack to get black people hooked >(thus >keeping the underclass imprisoned in chains of addiction and financing >their >games in South America at the same time), I scoffed. Then I remembered >there's a precedent in British history. Many precedents in many >histories, >really (such as distributing liquor to Native Americans, giving free >cigs to >American soldiers--different, but connected, purposes). > >> "I tell you Watson. The murderer was an 8-legged purple chicken with >one >> eye, a hair lip, a glaswegian accent and a limp. See! Look at the >little >> dancing fairies!" >> "Oh dear, Holmes. Have you been at the opium pipe again? Fancy a >quick >game >> of hide the chutney ferret?" > >LOL! I especially love mention of the fairies--you know your >Conan-Doyle, >man! > >From: : >> Opium is a slow lazy sort of groove. Holmes preferred to inject >cocaine, >> which suited his personality. Watson described Holmes in the Canon >as >being >> (apparently) a manic-depressive. A case would charge him up and he'd >happily >> crawl around looking for clues with his magnifying glass or play >strange >> tunes on his violin, but on his offtime he would sink into >depression and >> would alleviate it with the famous 7% solution. > >Yes, but I do remember Holmes taking opium for a while. Watson >questioned >him about it in one of the stories and Holmes responded with something >like, >"No, Watson, I'm back to my old love, cocaine." > >> Opium strikes me as something Watson would use, if he wasn't such a >proper >> sort. > >Well, he's a doctor after all--plenty of access. On the other hand, >he's >seen what it does to people. > >From: Nightstar: >> "Phttttttttttttttttttttttttt........... oh wow, man, far >> out..........whewwwwwwwwwwwww" > >Thanks for the comment, dude, but hey, don't forget to SNIP, 'kay? >Responding to a big message without snipping and then adding 2 lines >is like >gonna bring The Man down on us! Here, have some of my munchies... > >David Farnell -- Fukuoka, Japan >"Ua mau ke ea o ka aina i ka pono." > > > > ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------ End of deltagreen-digest V2 #19 *******************************