From: owner-deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org (deltagreen-digest) To: deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org Subject: deltagreen-digest V2 #26 Reply-To: Delta Green List Sender: owner-deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org Errors-To: owner-deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org Precedence: bulk deltagreen-digest Sunday, August 8 1999 Volume 02 : Number 026 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 09:12:03 +0900 (JST) From: ft203004@fsinet.or.jp (Jay and Mikiko ) Subject: DG: DG -- Why the Secrecy > When you do focus on foriegn events, show them in such a light as the >rest of the world is backwards, filled with wannabe Hitlers and filth, death >and decay. You further become an isolated sheep, glad for whatever powers >that be to do what they will to keep your American dream alive and sweep the >nasties under the rug. Actually, Dave, isn't this what DG is doing? This message made me wonder if there isn't a conspiracy behind DG to maintain power by keeping the public unware of paranormal phenomenon. While the DG investigators themselves might be seriously attempting to fight the mythos, what if they're actually working to weed out the competition for some other great power? I mean after all, are we really helping people by keeping them in the dark about everything? Jay - ------------------------------------------ There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness." Dave Barry, _Twenty-five Things I have Learned in Fifty Years_ - ------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 20:38:42 -0400 From: "Andrew D. Gable" Subject: DG: Re: The BOYS >Purpouse: so far, the only justification I have heard for the BOYS >existence is that they are obsessed with Thwarting the Mi-go's >'machinations' on this planet. Is this the only reason they exist? Or do >they have aims/goals that stretch beyond this rather limited mission >statement? The BOYS probably see the Mi-Go (who respect the GOO, but don't serve them) as, basically, heathens. Intelligent and valuable heathens, perhaps, but heathen nonetheless. Thus, the BOYS' conflict with the aliens is probably more of a holy war than anything else - they probably only disguise their activities as saving mankind from the Mi-Go to make them seem more acceptable and "the lesser of two evils," as you wrote. >Religion: We Know the BOYS worship Hastur. But what form does >this worship take? What is The BOYS relationship with other Hastur >worshipping cults? What is their connection with the King in Yellow? I think this leads directly into their not being "the lesser of two evils" - in fact, quite possibly, they're worse than the aliens they're "saving" us from. The Mi-Go's tortures at least serve a purpose; the BOYS' activities (if those ascribed to the K'n-yani in "The Mound" are any indication) are totally pointless and chaotic. Just like how I picture Hastur's worship, BTW: on the surface, the priests are serving a god, but the cult's been warped so much as to be unrecognizable, and now Hastur / King in Yellow cultists are merely glorified libertines. In modern society, the BOYS are mostly eugenicists: some may have been behind the Nazi ideal of the Aryan superman. I base this on a reference (apocryphal, or in HPL?) that the K'n-yani are humans, as they were meant to be before the Mi-Go tampered with our genes. I think they'd be interested in retro-engineering of the human race, and in psychic phenomena (the K'n-yani are reputed to be telepaths). Therefore, if they have had any dealings with MJ-12, it may have been in MKULTRA and related projects. Didn't the Mi-Go fight with the Elder Things? And they (inadvertently) created humans...thus the K'n-yani. Maybe the BOYS have inherited the ET's dislike of the Mi-Go? Andrew D. Gable gable@redrose.net "'Reality' is the only word in the language that should always be used in quotes." My Life With The Thrill Kill Kult, "Nervous Xians" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 15:45:42 -0300 (ART) From: kranondp@usa.net Subject: DG: Delta Green Eyes 1 LURKING MODE: OFF Hello. I've just got a copy of the second volume of the DGEO. I tried to get also the first one, Machinations of the Mi-Go, but the Pagan folks tell me that it is sold out :(. Anyone know where I may get it? Some one has a spare copy that he is willing to sell? I would really love to get my hands on it. Thanks. Bruno Di Pentima. kranondp@usa.net Santa Fe - Argentina. "No está muerto lo que puede yacer eternamente, y con extraños evos puede morir hasta la muerte." -- Howard Phillips Lovecraft. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 23:52:36 -0500 (CDT) From: Tenebrous Technologies Subject: DG: Hey! Where is me copy of 'Countdown'? Didn't I win one of the darn things? Tenebrous Technologies ;) +_+_+_+_+_+_+ Tenebrous Technologies- 'What we are up to is none of your business' A tradition in Guile, Deceit and Treachery since 1997 Matt Cowger, CEO tenebrae@earthling.net http://home.gvi.net/~tenebrae Vox: (###)###-##### +_+_+_+_+_+_+ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 01:35:51 EDT From: USFORREC1@aol.com Subject: Re: DG: DG -- Why the Secrecy In a message dated 8/7/99 8:15:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ft203004@fsinet.or.jp writes: << Actually, Dave, isn't this what DG is doing? This message made me wonder if there isn't a conspiracy behind DG to maintain power by keeping the public unware of paranormal phenomenon. While the DG investigators themselves might be seriously attempting to fight the mythos, what if they're actually working to weed out the competition for some other great power? I mean after all, are we really helping people by keeping them in the dark about everything? >> I don't dispute this idea at all. I already fought on that particular thread a while back. Without trying to bring back the Devil's Advocate and Why We Fight threads, I personally believe (and reflect this in my own campaign) that DG and similar groups are very much cults in their own right. Their religion isn't the mythos but they hold their beliefs in a similar, fanatical way. That's not to say they are evil or their fight isn't just, it is just that in their guerrilla war against the mythos they have become very much like their adversaries. At least that is how I portray them in my campaign. they have their skeletons, their shady deals and don't wear the white hats. One of the NPCs that my players encounter is sort of that sinister force you speak of. he hasn't been corrupted by the mythos, though. he instead is obsessed with mythos destruction. He has converted his cell and built up a small group of personal Friendlies. he attacks the mythos with a zeal that few other agents can achieve. He also is far less discriminate with innocents that get in the way. He feels that A Cell is too obssessed with their covert war and wants to take it to the next level-a full fledged, world-wide jihad with DG as the ruling body of the masses. He is preparing for a power struggle with A Cell to assume control of DG and start this modern inquistion/crusade. he is a man that employs torture, drugs, and every other dirty trick, reflecting the dark side of DG for us and how easy it is to become a monster without being mythos-tainted. Now, that's just how we play and certainly isn't to everyone's beliefs/tastes. for us it adds a sinister element to the game. Is A Cells orders really for the good of all or has the war they fight skewered the perceptions? Is this "religious" DG group the way to go or not? And so on. It keeps the game in the moral grey area for us and keeps them wondering. Anyway, hope someone found that rant useful... - -Dave K ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 03:41:03 EDT From: LizardRoi@aol.com Subject: DG: The Sixth Sense (not one damn spoiler) I had a good day today. I managed to find the illusive Volume One of Rhino's Blues Masters collection, nearly finished a short story I'm rather pleased with and saw a good movie. ObDG: psychic phenomena That's all you get folks. No foreshadowing, no clues. It's great, take my word for it. It is worth your time. See it as soon as you can before some dipshit reveals too much in a review. And it is relevant to a thread. See it, and ask yourself this: could it be done as a novel? Could a novel simultaneously reveal and hide clues about what is really happening the way the script and director did? And would it be as good? Eyes Wide Shut The Blair Witch Project The Sixth Sense Life is good. Or at least the moviegoing part of it is. Mark McFadden Offshore listmembers are advised to go deaf on the subject of The Sixth Sense until you can see it for yourself. I didn't know diddly about it until the movie started, and I'm pleased with the result. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 12:40:06 +0100 From: "Gary Matthews" Subject: Re: DG: Total eclipse of the sun > Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 15:23:29 -0400 > From: graemep@immagene.mcg.edu (Graeme Price) > Subject: Re: DG: Total eclipse of the sun > Regarding the eclipse (which coincides with at least one listmember's > birthday... cheers Gaz), it is supposedly a very profund event regarding > astrological significance - end of the age of aquarius or something like > that. Whether or not this is of any mythos significance is upto individual > keeper's I guess, but there's been a lot of talk by the doom and gloom > merchants that it may relate to one of Nostradamus' prophecies about the > King of Terror coming from the sky or some such. Personally, I don't tend > to build things like this into my own campaigns... I find that they make > rather good red herrings to send investigators off on a complete tangent. You remembered!!! Does this mean I'll have a card waiting for me when (if) I get back from Cornwall after thanking everybody who went down there to celebrate said birthday? And thanks for the promotion from lurker to listmember. Not sure whether it's justified yet... From: becole@juno.com >On Fri, 06 Aug 1999 22:23:29 +0200 PM writes: >>As most of you will know there will be a total eclipse of the sun in >>Europe next week. There will be druidic activity around Stonehenge, > >Total eclipse of the sun........activity around Stonehenge........old and >rumored to be enchanted? Hope no one falls asleep there..... > > Sounds like a fine place for the stone trap door into the Gug's >kingdom....make sure you take some ghouls, and just for good measure, >maybe a couple of cats. > > > -B > > Going to recon ahead in the DL Already there... From: "Stabernide -" >I can't remember the reference, but I read somewhere sometime ago that >during the last eclipse, a ridicolously large number of people 'dissapeared' >during the last eclipse If it happens this time, then send out the Navy and Air Force - I know Cornwall would like to be independent from the rest of the UK, and I think I've discovered how they're going to do it.....a million and a half increase in population---in a fairly small land mass / peninsula....few thousand tonnes of carefully placed explosive material.......all of this gives you your own DIY floating country. Pretty good excuse for missing work - "you'll never guess where I am?" Gary ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 13:42:02 +0200 From: Davide Mana Subject: DG: [fiction] Chasing the Bride (Part 6) Chasing the Bride - pt. 6 There was a big, rigidly stuffed beaver hanging from the ceiling over the crowded desk, which was obvious in a twisted manner and fitting the ambience and the pattern. The large room at the top of the old house on Thinkers Lane smelled mostly of musty old books and that shoe-cabinet aroma that very old parchment gets with time, scrolls and volumes randomly packed over shelves and tables, bifurcated silk bookmarks like pulled tongues protruding from the thick pages, letting off a faint creaking sound, like they were slowly breathing, as in sleep. On the desktop lay a small silver Slannesh idol, with an incense stick burning, and a complex armillary sphere, describing orbits unknown, and a moltitude of writing implements, seals and wax sticks, a horn-handled magnifying lens and a large glass balloon half filled with dirty-green water in which small phosphorescent medusae swam lazily with nowere to go. Light filtered through the dark yellow oiled paper of the large window overlooking the table, and the air was hot and dry like a desert wind, vague riffles causing slight movements in the hanging chimes and causing a DaVinciesque balsawood model contraption to turn clockwise before starting back on the string from which it was suspended. - Such unespected pleasure, - bowed our host, slithering back and letting us in with a flicker of its furcated tongue. I gave him a wary nod. In the grip of the whalebones, Val courtsied, eyes fixed on our host. He went back to his high-backed chair, and gestured. - Please be seated.... Posh as they get, is Ss-la-hesh, and extremely nice in a polishhed, old world way that gives me the creeps. There is, in its languid movements and affected manner, the inherent menace of a member of a race that was there when we were stashing nuts and dead grasshoppers away in the Cretaceous. He leaned back, head nodding a bit with each breath, thongue lashing out now and again. He wore a high-collared Fu Manchu coat and a pair of bottle-butt pince-nez spectacles balanced at the end of his snout. - Refreshments? - he asked, pointing to a glass cabinet witha few dusty bottles in it. - I seldom see guests theese days, y'see, so selection's somewhat scarce. - We are fine, thanks. A four fingered hand picked up a paper knife infinitely less sharp than the talons holding it from the lap of the idol representing our hosts's namesake, and the vertically-slit, humorous eyes scanned us, hesitating slightly over Val's features. - So? - he distractedly tapped the balloon, sending a blur of activity through the medusae's colony - I suppose this visit's therefore somehow service-biased? For all our long backlog of bargains and mutual favours, I don't trust the bugger. Extinct or not, he's from a people that has an unmatched hostility record when we humans are concerned. Go ask the Valusians. A refugee and an out cast, Ss-la-hesh can be more curteous than a bartender on a slow night, and confined to this cluttered loft of his, a refugee and an outcast, but he's still a certified Phillips-class dreamer, with a few aeons of racial tricks up his wide, flame-patterned sleeves. For all his friendly attitude, I still think he's just waiting for the right occasion to get us mammals back in our place. Under. And anyone holding a formaldeide-preserved human foetus on his window-sill has a lot of bowing to do to gain my trust, and in that sense Ss-la-hesh's backbone is distinctively rigid, for a reptile. While I kept a skeptical eye on him, Val gave him a need-to-know overview of the events, and a slip of paper holding some of the gliphs we had singled out on the punk-palace walls. Ss-la-hesh listened, keeping his eyes on her. She placed the slip of paper in front of him, and he did not move to pick it up, but looked down to read it. A hiss. A curteous nod. He stood and moved to a shelf. - It has been such a stretch since I last saw something similar.... - he mumbled. A book resting on a nearby lectern was dropped on the floor and replaced, pages flashing past as he browsed purposefully. The tongue leashed out. - So, - he sentenced, tapping the page with a talon. - As I guessed.... He pointed to the page, leaning back. We stood and leaned closer to look. He lacked the tipically ophidian smell I anticipated, and was instead faintly scented of something like violets. Val placed our sample on the yellowed page. The characters there, though more clearly printed than the scribbles on the wall or our rendition thereof, were clearly the same language. - So? - I echoed him. - Sarnathian. Specifically, Old or Higher Sarnathian. - Being phisically unable to shrugh, he flexed his tail, heading back to the desk. I wondered at his possible age once again. - - Hideographs, - he continued. - A small sample from some long lost style. A song, possibly. - Do you read it? - Sufficiently. Playing hide and seek with the viper was costing us time we did not have. Val placed a more complete transcript in front of him. - Enough to translate this. A twitch of the pallid lips, something that might have been a smile, might have been something more subtly aggressive. - Studying it some, yes. - Do it. The eyes behind the green-tinted spectacles were as cold as the critter's hearts, and devious. - Sir, this translation service is the practice substaining my simple lifestyle, and you should appreciate.... Haggling time. But we had come prepared, and I had spent long hours memorizing the photographs and replicating the twirly script. I fished out the bamboo roll, undid the string and showed him the first few inches, exposing two or three segments. He hissed, an unsophisticated, animal sound. - Hsan's Seven Secret Statement Scrolls.... - he leaned closer, and I stepped back. - A passably decent decypherment. - I guess you are familiar with the text, - Val said, while I kept the roll in front of him but out of reach. He tried to downplay his interest, but it was too late. - I should still have a reproduction of the selfsame.... He turned vaguely towards the shelves, waving a taloned forepaw, gears turning in his mind, betrayed by the nervous movements of his long, thin tail under the table. - Not of this one, - I said, cutting him short. Val stepped forward, and lifted a hand, forefinger pointing to the ceiling. - - Sealed with the emblem of the wheel, of the key, of the hearth of the rdo-rje, - she proclaimed, in something that was also, I knew, a discreet flexing of non-obvious oneiric muscles. Her voice rang in the room like a peal from some distant bell, and the light seemed to dim and the air to cool. Ss-la-hesh's pupils dilated. - The Fifth Sacred Aspect's Own copy. I see. I rolled back the scroll and put it back in its satchell. The snakeman nodded just once. - So. How many paragraphs? - Fifteen. We had almost the double written down, but we had no reason to let him know straight away. - I'll translitterate the script, - he conceded. - If you would please seat and be patient.... - It was easier than I espected, - Val said as we got out. - And cheaper. - I'm not so sure. Did you see the greed in the snake's eyes? I just wondered what we really gave him. In our line of work, giving the gift of books can really mess you up big time. She was pretty cool about it. - The Fifth Lama's copy of the Hsan book is pretty tame. He's just one of those collector freaks. I was unconvinced. We would not be the first man and woman team convinced of having struck a real bargain with a snake, after all. Back over the Croc we studied the script, now readable in Ss-la-hesh's neat, almost feminine calligraphy. It was familiar, as it was to be espected. The 'Lands can be a bibliophyle's nightmare - from holy texts to science fiction, everythings seems to wash up on the Slumber Shores, ending up in basreliefs, papyruses, incunabula, clay tablets and dot-marked chaboola tusks. Or maybe it's the other way around. Maybe it's the wakeworlders that get the recycled stuff, and the only true wakeworlder-originated prose is in computing manuals. Scary. We went through it once over a light repast of basmati-like pilau and roasted mutton. "Look not upon me, because I am black, because the sun hath looked upon me" - Solomon's Song? - asked Val. I'd never have marked her for the Bible pounding sort, but when she produced a copy - Bibles being two piastres a dozen in certain markets of Hlanith - we could go to the incriminated text and compare it with our own. And sure, there it was. But different. "I opened to my bride; but my bride had withdrawn herself, and was gone: souls failed when she spake: I sought her, but I could not find her; I called her, but she gave me no answer." The discrepancies increased as the text progressed. "I charge you, O daughters of Hali, if ye find my bride, that ye tell her, that I am sick of love, and chasing her." - Somehow this one sounds infinitely more sinister than the original. Val nodded. - Looks like it's gonna be a rough shag all right. [end of part 6 - really] ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 08:47:46 -0400 From: Steven Kaye Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! At 6:03 PM -0400 8/2/99, ScottSaylo@aol.com wrote: > >Actually it was a little later, historically, that opium addiction became a >badge of 'sensitivity, artistic temperment and eccentricity". The age of >Byron, Coleridge, Poe and romantic young men burning themselves up in >drug-assisted ennui was 1810-1870 or so. Lots of Civil War soldiers got hooked on opiates (morphine, IIRC - I'm not sure whether heroin had been developed yet), due to the wonderful state of Civil War era medicine. Steven - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - ---------- Steven Kaye box_nine@ix.NOSPAM.netcom.com "Now, just let me fix this band on your head," I added, as I adjusted the electrode. -- William Hope Hodgson, "The Hog" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 09:30:03 -0400 From: Steven Kaye Subject: Re: DG: Revisionism > > Okay. So now hopefully everyone knows why it is so important to >keep those NRO assassins you caught separated until you finish >interrogating them! Also, all Delta Green operatives should keep their >AARs (After-Action-Reports) to a high level of detail, if it appears to >be something trivial, ask a policeman how much paperwork follows a single >discharge of his service weapon. So when you ask your players for a >debriefing, don't slouch. If they can't explain what they did to their >Cell leader, then they may have a very hard time explaining it to that >Congressional Oversight Committee. Which leads to the interesting question - in a world when Consume Likeness, Cloud Memory, etc. are all viable tactics - what's the standard of proof for cell reports? Does Alphonse go for independent verification - maybe a shadow network of fact-checkers and cleaners? Take things on faith until the bodies start piling up? Steven - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - ---------- Steven Kaye box_nine@ix.NOSPAM.netcom.com "Now, just let me fix this band on your head," I added, as I adjusted the electrode. -- William Hope Hodgson, "The Hog" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 11:17:10 -0400 From: Steven Kaye Subject: Re: DG: Re: The BOYS At 8:38 PM -0400 8/7/99, Andrew D. Gable wrote: > >The BOYS probably see the Mi-Go (who respect the GOO, but don't serve them) >as, basically, heathens. Intelligent and valuable heathens, perhaps, but >heathen nonetheless. Thus, the BOYS' conflict with the aliens is probably >more of a holy war than anything else - they probably only disguise their >activities as saving mankind from the Mi-Go to make them seem more >acceptable and "the lesser of two evils," as you wrote. Note that, depending on whom you take "Him Who is not to be Named" to be in the liturgy recorded in "The Whisperer in Darkness," the Mi-Go might also be worshippers of Hastur. Which lends credence to the religious war angle. A question is whether the BOYS represent 'mainstream' K'n-yani culture, as depicted in "The Mound," or whether they're an activist offshoot. Without giving away the story, "The Mound" does seem to depict the K'n-yani as introverted, languid aesthetes. Also, I tend to make K'n-yan MUCH bigger than just a small portion of the Midwest underground. There are stories about advanced underground civilizations along the West Coast, with one of their main cities being under what is now the main branch of the Los Angeles Public Library. Honest, you can look it up on LAPL's web page: http://www.lapl.org/central/urbanleg.html Their name, the Brotherhood of the Yellow Sign, suggests primarily involvement with the King in Yellow. I never envisaged an organized cult of the King in Yellow, Secret Senate notwithstanding. More like, every advanced civilization generates its own avatar of the King -cue Spengler on the decline of the West, etc. The question of whether there is an external force, the King in Yellow, which causes people to write SAN-loss inducing plays, or whether it's one of the less pleasant residents of the collective unconscious I like to keep vague. Some cultures survive it - most don't. Derleth and Carter talk about Hastur as lord of interstellar spaces and what-not, which could lead to interesting conjectures about the founding of the US space program, JPL, Jack Parsons, the L5 Society, and assorted mystical-astronomical weirdness. Perhaps the Shan aren't the only ones that want to leave the planet before the stars are right? Steven - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - ---------- Steven Kaye box_nine@ix.NOSPAM.netcom.com "Now, just let me fix this band on your head," I added, as I adjusted the electrode. -- William Hope Hodgson, "The Hog" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 15:56:01 -0400 From: "Andrew D. Gable" Subject: DG: Re: The BOYS >Note that, depending on whom you take "Him Who is not to be >Named" to be in the liturgy recorded in "The Whisperer in >Darkness," the Mi-Go might also be worshippers of Hastur. Which >lends credence to the religious war angle. I believe I heard something once to the effect that there was an RL god - perhaps Phrygian - who was called He Who Is Not To Be Named. Which, of course, conjures up ideas about the Celtic god Cernunnos, whose true name couldn't be uttered (and is still unknown). BTW, Cernunnos was a stag-headed god of the wilderness - which calls to mind Hastur's home in Taurus, the Bull, even though the god seems to be rather Shub-Niggurath-ish. Called the Gallic Pan, surmised to be the basis for the "lord of the forest" spoken of by Medieval werewolves. >Also, I tend to make K'n-yan MUCH bigger than just a small portion >of the Midwest underground. Like our favorite little pointy-toothed Mongoloids, K'n-yan probably exists in isolated places all over the world. There may be quite a large center in the British Isles - accounting for the tales of faeries, "Sidhe-mounds," non-Celtic, non-Roman artifacts, etc. >There are stories about advanced underground civilizations along >the West Coast, with one of their main cities being under what is Aren't the Hav-Musuvs (see DGEOV1) connected with underground cities? And the Hav-Musuvs are the Mi-Go, so... > Derleth and Carter talk about Hastur as lord of interstellar spaces >and what-not, which could lead to interesting conjectures about the >founding of the US space program, JPL, Jack Parsons, the L5 >Society, and assorted mystical-astronomical weirdness. The Free Hastur spell requires nine monoliths in a V shape. Hastur's home constellation, Taurus, is an uneven V. So V shapes (and maybe triangles, too - hell, maybe the #3 in general, since the Yellow Sign's a triskelion) are connected with the cult of Hastur. In connection with Hastur's being "the lord of interstellar spaces," this leads into all sorts of neat speculations on why triangular forms are so prevalent in the aerospace industry and in UFO sightings. Aw, hell - just ponder the origins of Delta Green itself. Formed to combat Cthulhu (well, indirectly, anyway) - just as Hastur does. Anti-Grey - the same as the BOYS. Plus, our symbol is a TRIANGLE! Perhaps DG's a cult of Hastur... >Perhaps the Shan aren't the only ones that want to leave the planet >before the stars are right? Maybe the Mi-Go screwing with our genetics and taking away the abilities humans/K'n-yani were supposed to have had two purposes - to further their knowledge of how we humans work, and to ensure they had test subjects in the future. Agent Conkle's done a rather interesting write-up on the K'n-yani / MIB connection. Forget the exact URL, but I highly suggest you check it out, it's on his website. Very well done. Andrew D. Gable gable@redrose.net "'Reality' is the only word in the language that should always be used in quotes." My Life With The Thrill Kill Kult, "Nervous Xians" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 15:56:11 EDT From: ScottSaylo@aol.com Subject: Re: DG: Reefer Madness! In a message dated 8/8/99 7:52:01 AM Central Daylight Time, box_nine@ix.netcom.com writes: << Lots of Civil War soldiers got hooked on opiates (morphine, IIRC - I'm not sure whether heroin had been developed yet), due to the wonderful state of Civil War era medicine. >> Heroin was hailed as a CURE for morphine addiction in the late civil war period. THen by golly they found out it was even more addicting. But taking a lot of heroin sure kills that nagging need for more morphine. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 16:47:39 -0400 From: Daniel Harms Subject: Re: DG: Hey! At 11:52 PM 8/7/99 -0500, Tenebrous wrote: >Where is me copy of 'Countdown'? Didn't I win one of the darn things? My guess is that it'll be on its way shortly. One lesson I've learned from dealing with publishers is that they are in business to make money. Therefore, when it comes to doling out new books, they usually take care of the people who have paid them for the book first, then send them out to those to whom they don't have a financial obligation afterward. Yes, this does mean that your gaming buddies may get a copy of Countdown before you do, but hey, you're getting yours for FREE, and you're mentioned in the credits. So it works out for you in the long run. Waiting patiently for his contributor's copy, Daniel Harms dmharms@acsu.buffalo.edu "I had come frighteningly near to the capture of an old secret which ventured close to man's haunts and lurked cautiously just beyond the edge of the known. Yet in the end I had nothing." - H. P. Lovecraft and Robert H. Barlow ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 16:55:37 -0400 From: Daniel Harms Subject: Re: DG: Revisionism At 09:30 AM 8/8/99 -0400, Steven Kaye wrote: >Which leads to the interesting question - in a world when Consume >Likeness, Cloud Memory, etc. are all viable tactics - what's the >standard of proof for cell reports? Does Alphonse go for independent >verification - maybe a shadow network of fact-checkers and cleaners? >Take things on faith until the bodies start piling up? I'd say the latter. Given the abilities in the DG setting for ghouls, there's little they could do if one of these beings decided to infiltrate the organization. Then again, don't forget we're dealing with a group filled with espionage agents. When you get down to it, how much difference is there between a ghoul who knows a person's mind and a turncoat? What's the difference between Consume Likeness and plastic surgery? There are differences, but the principles probably remain the same. Yrs., Daniel Harms dmharms@acsu.buffalo.edu "I had come frighteningly near to the capture of an old secret which ventured close to man's haunts and lurked cautiously just beyond the edge of the known. Yet in the end I had nothing." - H. P. Lovecraft and Robert H. Barlow ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 17:29:38 EDT From: LizardRoi@aol.com Subject: Re: DG: Re: The BOYS In a message dated 8/8/99 8:29:15 AM Pacific Daylight Time, box_nine@ix.netcom.com writes: << Also, I tend to make K'n-yan MUCH bigger than just a small portion of the Midwest underground. There are stories about advanced underground civilizations along the West Coast, with one of their main cities being under what is now the main branch of the Los Angeles Public Library. Honest, you can look it up on LAPL's web page: http://www.lapl.org/central/urbanleg.html >> Very interesting. But now you know too much. Mark McFadden The Lizard King ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 18:29:02 -0400 From: Daniel Harms Subject: Re: DG: Re: The BOYS At 05:29 PM 8/8/99 EDT, you wrote: >In a message dated 8/8/99 8:29:15 AM Pacific Daylight Time, >box_nine@ix.netcom.com writes: ><< Also, I tend to make K'n-yan MUCH bigger than just a small portion of > the Midwest underground. There are stories about advanced underground > civilizations along the West Coast, with one of their main cities > being under what is now the main branch of the Los Angeles Public > Library. Honest, you can look it up on LAPL's web page: > http://www.lapl.org/central/urbanleg.html > Very interesting. But now you know too much. And then there's me. There's a more in-depth article here: http://www.deja.com/=dnc/[ST_rn=ps]/getdoc.xp?AN=352088521 To quote a paragraph near the end: "However, the Federal Government definitely stepped in during the '50s and took control of the entire underground tunnel system for their Cold War operations, adding many new paranoid-influenced improvements over the years that followed. In the '9Os, suspicious arson fires prevented well-equipped - ONI - intelligence operatives from gaining access to the secret entrance that was located in the basement of the so-called 'public' library. There is more to this story than can be told at this time." Now, what's all this? A failed DG op? Yrs., Daniel Harms dmharms@acsu.buffalo.edu "I had come frighteningly near to the capture of an old secret which ventured close to man's haunts and lurked cautiously just beyond the edge of the known. Yet in the end I had nothing." - H. P. Lovecraft and Robert H. Barlow ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 18:34:37 EDT From: LizardRoi@aol.com Subject: DG: The Lizard People Excerpt from http://www.lapl.org/central/urbanleg.html The Lizard People Below downtown Los Angeles, in an area starting at Dodger Stadium and ending under the Central Library, lies an ancient city remembered only in old Indian legends, an underground world built by a strange race that vanished five thousand years ago. In 1934, a mining engineer, W. Warren Shufelt, began searching for this city. He had heard about it in a Hopi legend about the “Lizard People.” They were a lost race who built thirteen underground cities along the Pacific Coast after a holocaust about 3000 B.C. The subterranean settlements held a thousand families each, with food supplies. They bored the tunnels using chemical solutions that melted the bedrock. Among other things, the Lizard People possessed golden tablets that chronicled their race's history, the origin of humans, and the history of the world since creation. (Quite appropriate for the library setting). Me again. 1) 1934, eh? Hmmmmmm. 2) The chemical melting of the bedrock reminded me of some theories in an old National Geographic that many stone monoliths were not solid rock hauled over hundreds of miles, but rubble that was liquefied and cast into monolith blocks at the site. 3) Maybe Serpents aren't the only reptilian People. Or maybe Lizard is a better description of bilaterally symmetrical quadrupeds with tails. 4) Holocaust? A lost race? Got to look up more on Anasazi. 5) Gotta get ahold of them golden tablets. 6) 13 cities? Does that include Samson, CA? Mark McFadden El Rey Del Lagarto ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 18:51:30 EDT From: LizardRoi@aol.com Subject: Re: DG: Re: The BOYS In a message dated 8/8/99 3:33:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time, dmharms@acsu.buffalo.edu writes: << Now, what's all this? A failed DG op? Yrs., Daniel Harms dmharms@acsu.buffalo.edu >> Forget it, Dan. It's Chinatown. Mark McFadden Soy El Rey Del Lagarto. Puedo hacer cualquier cosa. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 13:50:03 +0900 From: "David Farnell" Subject: DG: Re: DG -- Why the Secrecy? / BOYS From: Jay and Mikiko: > This message made me wonder if there isn't a conspiracy behind DG to > maintain power by keeping the public unware of paranormal phenomenon. While > the DG investigators themselves might be seriously attempting to fight the > mythos, what if they're actually working to weed out the competition for > some other great power? I mean after all, are we really helping people by > keeping them in the dark about everything? Ah, DG controlled by another faction of aliens...or ARE they? Actually, some time ago I thought about DG being a front for the BOYS. But I decided that DG's paranoia, which is even self-directed, should keep them reasonably free of such influences. I know, I was being naive. Maybe some factions of the BOYS are careful enough, and assimilated into human society enough, that they could indeed effect such a plan. After all, they're immortal (or at least immortal enough from our perspective). From: Andrew D. Gable: Subject: DG: Re: The BOYS > The BOYS probably see the Mi-Go (who respect the GOO, but don't serve them) > as, basically, heathens. Intelligent and valuable heathens, perhaps, but > heathen nonetheless. Thus, the BOYS' conflict with the aliens is probably > more of a holy war than anything else - they probably only disguise their > activities as saving mankind from the Mi-Go to make them seem more > acceptable and "the lesser of two evils," as you wrote. Maybe. I always went with the "You scumbag fungi experimented on my great-grandmother!" revenge motive. I figure the K'n Yannis have a considerably better understanding of the cosmos than we, and so concepts like "heathen" mean little to them. Also, the K'n Yannis are still fighting to survive--there's not many of them, and the Mi=Go would probably love to finish them off. > In modern society, the BOYS are mostly eugenicists: some may have been > behind the Nazi ideal of the Aryan superman. I base this on a reference > (apocryphal, or in HPL?) that the K'n-yani are humans, as they were meant to > be before the Mi-Go tampered with our genes. I think they'd be interested in > retro-engineering of the human race, and in psychic phenomena (the K'n-yani > are reputed to be telepaths). Therefore, if they have had any dealings with > MJ-12, it may have been in MKULTRA and related projects. Retro-engineering SOME of the human race--they'll still need plenty of slaves. And they could be planning to make genetic castes: At the top, "pure" K'n-Yannis; under them, genetically enhanced ubermenschen with psi powers; under them, various levels of slaves, pets, food sources, etc. Connections with MJ-12 could be interesting--BOYS trying to aid MJ projects that will be used against the Mi-Go. Dave ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 07:58:54 +0900 From: "David Farnell" Subject: Re: DG: Total eclipse of the sun From: Greg Muir: > Makes one wonder what the Aztecs would have been doing towards 2010, > assuming Europeans hadn't wiped them out. I always thought it would be > interesting to look at history from a skewed perspective, say that > instead of conquering these peoples the Spaniards were somewhat > assimilated instead. [snipola] Check out _Pastwatch: The Redemption of Christopher Columbus_, by Orson Scott Card. One of the fellow's best books. Looks in great detail at all the points you're talking about and (apart from time travel) handles it quite realistically. Makes for a great alternate timeline, too. Speaking of alternate timelines, I just saw the new edition of Dick's _The Man in the High Castle_. Very cool cover. For anyone who hasn't read that yet, it's a classic. Not to be missed if you ever want to run an alternate timeline Hitler-wins-WW2 game. Sadly, it doesn't deal with things in much detail, though. Dave ------------------------------ End of deltagreen-digest V2 #26 *******************************