From: owner-deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org (deltagreen-digest) To: deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org Subject: deltagreen-digest V2 #91 Reply-To: Delta Green List Sender: owner-deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org Errors-To: owner-deltagreen-digest@nocturne.org Precedence: bulk deltagreen-digest Tuesday, October 5 1999 Volume 02 : Number 091 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 23:04:25 -0400 From: Daniel Harms Subject: Re: DG: Earthquakes and the Mythos At 08:28 PM 10/4/99 -0400, the MiB wrote: >I'll bet on huge. They persecute the Dalai Lama and other Tibetans. >They had to send in the people's army to deal with an entire province >of ghouls in the 1950's. And they have a lot of secret archeology, like >the tomb of the first emperor (the one with the terra cotta warriors) >that Dan "the Man" Harms will explain presently. Just to be perverse, I won't explain, but I will provide a couple of URLs that any of you could have found in fifteen seconds: http://www.utexas.edu/courses/wilson/ant304/biography/arybios98/ smithbio.html http://westy.jtwn.k12.pa.us/users/mjr/china2.html Yrs., Daniel Harms dmharms@acsu.buffalo.edu The Internet: Learn what you know. Share what you don't. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 00:45:59 -0400 From: Greg Muir Subject: Re: DG: RE: Musings on the Emperor (was Re: Dark shadows) > As for Delta Green material, I think Asia is a hot bed of material for CoC. > I have already seen some discussions of the Dark Ocean Society, The Black > Dragon Society, the Yakuza, Unit 731,modern ultra-nationalists and Aum > Shinrikyo. however it appears to me that we have overlooked perhaps the most > foul conspiracy ever conceived, Pokemon !!! Now that's evil. I only hope > that the efforts to exploit Asia I handled as well as earlier efforts to > exploit the West. Japan has always had a close connection to the sea. I think it would be quite interesting to explore the Mythos connections the Imperial family could have here. After all, the Emperor is supposed to be descended from a god, suppose he really is. I could see some Deep One interractions here, possibly a hidden and unknown line of the family has progressed along with the public emperor, a family who have mingled their blood with the Deep Ones and who have secured certain favors for Japan. The kamakazi of ancient lore could have been a payback for services rendered. "Yeah, let the Mongols claim they were stymied by a typhoon. Father Dagon and Mother Hydra protect their children." There could be room for an interesting series of events towards the final days of the war. Remember how the Japanese on what was it, Okinawa? were commiting mass suicide to avoid torture at the hands of American soldiers? Perhaps it wasn't the wrath of the Americans they feared. And the capitulation after the atom bombings . . . the Japanese were previously prepared to fight to the death. They already faced the destruction of all their other major cities. Conventional history holds that they threw in the towel when they saw Russia would enter the picture and start gobbling territory. Perhaps the atom bombs were the reason for surrender. After all, we know what force lurks at the heart of atomic fireballs, the blind and idiot primal chaos. Perhaps the Japanese, upon seeing through the portal into the insatiable chaos, decided their Mythos gods weren't as powerful as the ones the Americans had awoken. Yeeps! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 01:12:08 -0400 From: Greg Muir Subject: Re: DG: Eso-terrorism > > I feel I must stand up for my country and say, "No, you want the guys > to the west of us!" - i.e., them there Norwegians. I was actually > going to post something about this in the music thread, since if there > is any musical grouping that's mythos-y, it's the Scandinavian/ > Northern European black/death/doom metal hordes. Have a gander at > this URL: http://www.lut.fi/~mega/muzac/news/SpinArticle.html , and > tell me that doesn't sound like people twisted by the mythos. There Jesus H. Christ. Those devil freaks make me positively glad that the evil we face here in the states is more mundane like Marilyn Manson and the Backstreet Boys. What is up with these morons? The death of that one Count Glackish guy, that got me thinking. After all his spouting about death and the glory of murder and all that, he was screaming for his life, begging for mercy when death finally came for him. The moment of revelation he went through there, where the childish fantasy of his Nordic myth-world came crumbling down and he was faced with grim mortality, I wonder what it felt like for him. I think that would be an interesting angle toe explore in a Mythos story, when it's time for a murderer gifted in the blackest of Mythos arts finally gets some of what he's been dishing out all these years. If we were to focus back on the death maven for a second, just imagine as his life pours from his body, he sees the white light coming for him and the coming of death. There is no Valhalla waiting for him, no mighty pagan gods to welcome him as a warrior. Instead there is the white light, the feeling of a force beyond his comprehension calling him home. This would be an interesting short story, spanning from the minutes before the attack through the "life-flashing-before-your-eyes" act of dying. There be some good drama here. ------------------------------ Date: 05 Oct 99 10:50:15 +0100 From: Peter Devlin Subject: DG: Shan Question (Possible Countdown Spoiler) POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER I could do with additional opinions on the following (potential) Shan spoiler: My understanding is that the Shans want to get off Earth but their templeships don't work within Earth's atmosphere or EM envelope. So they get involved in the takeover / manipulation of various space agencies, planning to get outside Earth's range and back to Lggyxx (or whatever, Neptune?). Why don't they simply use a Gate spell, one end tethered at Goatswood, the other at Lgggyyyyyxxxx then shove their templeship through on a transporter? They don't have such a spell? That I don't buy as they have the resources of PISCES, Severn Aerospace and an Azathoth power source at their disposal. They could get access to one readily enough. Some weird physical reason? If that were the case they could simply ride a human host through the gate. Anyone come up with a satisfactory explanation? Thoughts? :-) --> :-0 Peter Devlin Bell, Book and Candle - http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/columns.html The South Side - Gotta update that web page Email - pdevlin@scotsys.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 12:53:19 +0200 From: Juergen Hubert Subject: DG: The institution > > > "Consider the following scenario: > No secret organization can stay completely secret forever and the worst > has happened, DG has been compromised... Full disclosure has > been shown to the American people. What does the average public Joe's > opinion of Delta Green and its mission? What could and would DG make public > to save itself and its mission? You have to look at this question through > the lens of both Delta Green Agents and not role-players who know everything > about the mythos. What does DG really have they can show to justify their > existence? What will that public make out of its cowboy operations > (everything from Cambodia to Waco)? Could the public really form an unbiased > opinion of us and what will history say of us?" > > Interesting questions. Cynically, I'd hope that DG might avoid being compromised by > throwing the friendlies to the wolves, and using various agents to spread disinformation in > about the organization in a strategic manner. Maybe they can convince the public that a > relatively small group of anti-cultist vigilantes exist, but hide DG's existence. > > Even more cynically, far too few Americans are actually interested in current events or in > the abuses to our civil liberties which have been carried out, for example, because of the drug > war. Far fewer Americans will care what happened in Cambodia almost thirty years ago. Who did > what at Waco is fuzzy enough in the real world, and frankly, I think most Americans don't care > much one way or the other about how Koresh's people died, or who was responsible for killing > them. An investigation is under way now, but if it puts Janet Reno in a bad light, many very > loud voices will simply claim that it is "evil Republican extremists" grinding their > disreputable axes. Most Americans are either happily ignorant or too partisan to care about the > government really does. How can a DG connection be established that is strong enough to make a > sonombolistic public care about DG's involvement? Perhaps someone might profit from making the whole thing An Issue. A predidential candidate, perhaps (preferably from an independant platform), who learns of DG and accuses both Democrats and Republicans of sweeping the whole thing under the rug... - - Juergen Hubert ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 13:55:22 +0200 From: Juergen Hubert Subject: Re: DG: Botched DG op in Germany? > > The article goes on to quote an estimate that states that about 100 US > > intelligence agents are operating undercover in Germany. Wonder what > > they are doing there? (Other than industrial espionage, that is.) > > Spying. DUH! But seriously, I'm guessing that a lot of this is legacy from > the cold war. Those bad old commies are still around somewhere you know. > They must have a network in place, and someone has to run it, maybe the > Russian Mob, maybe an oligarch. Or maybe the CIA. After all, they stole many of the Stasi (the GDR's Secret Service which had files on at least a third of the GDR's population) personel files shortly after the Wall came down. And they refused to give them back to the German authorities (Quote: "We stole them fair and square!"). After several years, representatives of the German authorities were allowed to look into the files, but they had to file requests for specific files. I believe that an agreement was reached recently to return the files, though... All in all, the CIA knows a lot more about Communist moles planted by the GDR in Western Germany (and elsewhere) than the (Western) German authorities. They certainly have material to blackmail them. And they also have had enough opportunity to alter or "loose" files that might point the German authorities to those covert operatives... - - Juergen Hubert ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 12:59:48 -0000 From: "Crossingham, Adam" Subject: Re: DG: How close is 'Astronomy' to 'Our Darkest Hour'? [some spo ilers] Dennis Detwiller recently slapped me down publicly on the list, re the forthcoming 'Our Darkest Hour' supplement for WW2 DG. Dennis made mention of a private communication I had written the Pagan people in gushing fanboy style. I was bit pissed off about that, as the slap down that resulted was on the list. I don't like losing face publicly, nobody does. Dennis and I have now resolved our differences over private and public rejection notes, and have blamed it on unlucky delivery of e-mail. However I want to state here for the public record that all I submitted was a badly written mini-proposal, which was roundly rejected as it should have been. Anything else you might try to pin on me because of the second paragraph is untrue resulting of communication failure. As Dennis later made clear in the message, Pagan have no definite requirements for outside contributions. - -- Adam Crossingham E-mail: adam.crossingham@octavian1009.e-mail.com Any opinions expressed in this email are those of the individual and not necessarily the company. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 16:32:57 +200 From: yanasikt@superonline.com Subject: DG: Origins Part III This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ---=_hobbit37f9fe09 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If you read my ORIGINS post, you`ll remember that Yithians created humans for their new hosts after the failures of the Elder Things with the Deep Ones and Ghouls. ORIGINS Part III : At 10.500BC a change in the climate caused the melting of polar ice. A few humans managed to leave the sinking continents of Atlantis, Lemuria, Mu etc. Top people of this civilization with the help of astronomers, scientists and architects made their way into Yucatan, some into North Africa while the ignorant and worthless civilians shored to places soon to be under water or lost their way or swept to coasts of China to degenerate into Tcho-Tchos. Yet, humans weren`t the only ones got wet. Flying Polyps leaves their underground caverns as the water seeps in and flies to the dry lands. Some comes across the descendants of the sunken continents. Now can you see the reason why the civilizations of Yucatan who lived in beautiful forests and built great cities, carved images of winged and hairy worms to their walls instead of flowers or animals ? Anyway with the help of their kings who are Yithian hosts, they trapped the assaulting polyps deep underground. So did the Egyptians. They built a monstrous warning sign over the prison cavern. Which will be called Sphinx later. If you read Graham Hancock etc. you know that some elements of the pyramids are located so that they are likely to point at some specific constellation. But they don't. If you rewind the time, at 10.500BC to be exact they point at the correct constellations. An eternal reminder to the ones who know the truth... A few years ago a Deep One scouting team found the remains of Atlantis. They also found some well preserved stone tablets from a library dedicated to Yithians. They forwarded these to a Cthulhu cult in China or Japan -that's one of the things I want you to help me decide. The cult decoded some of the tablets and learned about the evolution project of Yithians. Now, before the end of millenium, minions of Cthulhu come up with the idea of changing the course of mankind`s evolution as the Yithians coded in our genes to convert the humans to deep ones. Also in my ORIGINS Part 1 post, I wrote about Dr.Zahi Hawass who banned certain archeologists who claimed to find underground tunnel networks under the pyramids and Sphinx. He's working for Omar Shakti. Shakti knows about trapped polyps. He also hopes to find some Yithian records about controlling them. With an army of Polyps, he thinks he can kick Alzis' ass. All these stuff is my new campaign. I've got questions. But I'll ask them tonight. Cheers, Tolga YANASIK ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 10:14:38 -0400 From: graemep@immagene.mcg.edu (Graeme Price) Subject: Re: DG: Shans & 'The Thing On The Doorstep' (Very, Very Minor COUNTDOWN Spoilers) Andrew wrote: [SOME MINOR COUNTDOWN SPOLIERS] >I don't recall if this question was brought up in any of our previous >discussions on Shans or not, but could a Shan jump bodies like a Traveler >through use of the mind transfer spell in 'The Thing On The Doorstep'? The >Shans are a quasi-physical race, true, and therefore shouldn't transfer >with the mental capacity of the brain, however the Shan information in >COUNTDOWN states that once in possession of a mind, the Insects lose their >physical status and in essence become one with the mind. Interesting food >for thought, and I can conceivably see the Army Of The Third Eye going >around trepanning people who aren't even infected, as the Shan leaps from >body to body. As written, there's no reason why a Shan couldn't just jump from body to body (in fact this has been reported in COUNTDOWN), but this wouldn't necessarily be effective use of it's powers. Firstly, the hosts are chosen for specific reasons - although in emergency anyone would be fair game. Second, it would increase the likelihood of detection dramatically if Shans kept jumping (the former hosts retain the ability to sense Shan hosts, and having a large number of people who claim to have had giant insects in their heads controlling their actions [would make an interesting legal defence though] will attract attention). Thirdly, the way I take it, gaining effective control of a host takes some time. The Shan could just take over directly, but this would probably destroy the host's mind too quickly. Better to corrupt the host gradually and make him/her willing to have the Shan onboard. That way the Shan doesn't have to be in control all the time (which would probably be mentally draining for the Shan itself). As for the Army trepanning people unnecessarily, this would definitely lead to a risk of detection/capture/worse for them. Better to move slowly and avoid attention. Anyway, just a few thoughts. Graeme graemep@immag.mcg.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 11:01:48 -0700 From: Jeff Ewing Subject: DG: More on the Horn of Africa The following is pulled from LEXIS/NEXIS, which my employer thoughtfully pays for: Copyright 1999 The New York Times Company The New York Times August 23, 1999, Monday, Late Edition - Final SECTION: Section A; Page 4; Column 3; Foreign Desk LENGTH: 1169 words HEADLINE: Peace Deal May Be Near for Ethiopia and Eritrea BYLINE: By IAN FISHER DATELINE: ON THE BADME PLAIN, Eritrea, Aug. 20 BODY: He is a carpenter who became a sniper but who is now very tired of shooting people in this largely overlooked war, deadlier by far than Kosovo. "Personally," said Feshtsion Tesfaldet, his finger on the trigger and his body tucked in a sandy trench here, "I don't want to see anyone else get killed." Rifle fire still rings out and mortar rounds still drop down, but after 15 months of a particularly senseless conflict, the killing may in fact stop soon along the disputed border of Eritrea and its larger neighbor, Ethiopia. Eritrea has accepted all points of a peace plan. Ethiopia is asking questions about only a few details. Nothing is certain, but President Clinton said last Monday that, "believe it or not," a deal seems near between the two allies of the United States on the Horn of Africa. He then mentioned the war's most ghastly aspect: 70,000 soldiers had died, he said, though his estimate was higher than most so far. Before the war began in May 1998, few countries held as much promise as Ethiopia and Eritrea, both poor but industrious and growing economically. And so the war -- fought in trenches with sickening numbers of casualties -- has been a depressing rebuke to so many hopes for Africa. The nations' allies watched in horror as Ethiopia and Eritrea turned their strengths against each other. They bought millions of dollars of warplanes and tanks and dug trenches. Ethiopia apparently spent thousands of young lives in human-wave assaults on Eritrea's positions, and bodies still lie in plain view, rotting in the rain. The article goes on to say that the whole thing dates back to Eritrea's independence in 1993, which left a border hazily defined. This border was drawn up by the Italians at the beginning of the century. Ghosts, ghosts everywhere. . . Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 11:21:48 -0400 From: "Ian Gorlick" Subject: DG: stranger than fiction I just clipped this from my local newspaper: " David Icke ... was once a high-profile television sports-caster and spokesman for Britain's Green Party. Now he's a conspiracy theorist of the highest order. He is currently touring North America promoting his latest book, The Biggest Secret, which claims the British Royal Family, the Rothschild banking family, and U.S. presidents like George Bush are all descendants of extra-terrestrial reptiles conspiring to rule the world. Mr. Bush, former British prime minister Ted Heath and others have even been seen shape-shifting into their real reptilian identities, according to Mr. Icke." (Has this guy been discussed on the DGML before?) He's obviously a bit confused. We know that the Serpent-Men are native to this planet, not extra-terrestrials. But could he be correct about how widely they have infiltrated the corridors of power? Has he mixed up the activities of the Serpent-Men and the Shan? What's going on between the Serpent-Men and the Shan in Britain? Are they co-operating or are they slugging it out in secret? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 11:41:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Daniel M Harms Subject: Re: DG: Shan Question (Possible Countdown Spoiler) On 5 Oct 1999, Peter Devlin wrote: > > POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER > > POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER > > POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER > > POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER > > POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER > > POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER > > POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER > > I could do with additional opinions on the following (potential) Shan spoiler: > > My understanding is that the Shans want to get off Earth but their > templeships don't work within Earth's atmosphere or EM envelope. So > they get involved in the takeover / manipulation of various space > agencies, planning to get outside Earth's range and back to Lggyxx >(or whatever, Neptune?). > Why don't they simply use a Gate spell, one end tethered at Goatswood, > the other at Lgggyyyyyxxxx then shove their templeship through on a > transporter? > They don't have such a spell? That I don't buy as they have the > resources of PISCES, Severn Aerospace and an Azathoth power source > at their disposal. They could get access to one readily enough. Or not. I was actually talking over this issue with some friends the other day. A number of different species - including the Yithians and the Elder Things - don't seem to have any sort of gate technology (save a reference or two to temporal gates for the ETs). This either means that a) gate technology is not as common as we have been led to think, or b) there's some sort of long-term problem with gate tech that humans haven't figured out (e.g. Project QUAKE). I think that the shan may indeed be unfamiliar with most gate technology. From what descriptions of their history I've seen, they've been largely dependent on their Azathoth-powered vessels for their conquests. Under such circumstances, the shan may not have used much gate technology at all before Shaggai exploded. I'd say it's likely that the small number of Shan who made it to earth have forgotten all about gate technology, or aren't sure about how to go about finding it. It may even be that those who have it are keeping it secret from the others, to maintain their status or as an ace in the hole. Too often I think that we fall into the trap of assuming that everyone in the Mythos world knows about everyone else. I think that it's quite the opposite: many people know a corner of the picture, but they're not interested in figuring out if it's part of a whole (or they've decided it's part of something else). Yrs., Daniel ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 16:41:48 GMT0BST From: Robert Thomas Subject: Re: DG: stranger than fiction Hello All, > I just clipped this from my local newspaper: > > " David Icke ... was once a high-profile television sports-caster and > spokesman for Britain's Green Party. Now he's a conspiracy theorist of the > highest order. Ah back to Mr Icke the erstwhile son of God. I'm sure he's been covered in the list before. He was a BBC sports reporter who suddenly decided that he was the Son of God and spent a few years in a (I think it was purple) shell suit. Haven't heard much of him in the UK recently. I think Graeme has mentioned him on the list before now, Haven't seen anything about shapeshifting reptiles though. Could be fun to tie him into the ARMY OTE in the UK <\evil grin> would make an excellent way for them to be discredited by PISCES by associating them with Icke in the event they ever got some evidence, the vast majority of the UK would assume they were flakes and not to be taken seriously Make for a great campaign Icke vs PISCES lol sorry it's been a long day. Rob. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 12:25:18 -0400 From: Bruce Ballon Subject: DG: RE: Shan Question (Possible Countdown Spoiler) - -----Original Message----- From: Peter Devlin [mailto:pdevlin@scotsys.co.uk] Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 1999 5:50 AM To: Delta Green List Subject: DG: Shan Question (Possible Countdown Spoiler) Importance: High POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER POSSIBLE COUNTDOWN SPOILER Re: Temple Ship Anyone come up with a satisfactory explanation? Thoughts? :-) --> :-0 The Temple ship itself has a Gate to Azathoth at its heart. It is unlikely they case pass the ship with an already powerful dimensional nexus inside it through another warp of space without causing major damage to the space time continuum...e.g. Azathoth is let loose destroying the ship, the shans, and sinks the British isles.... Bruce ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 12:03:35 -0400 (EDT) From: "Andrew D. Gable" Subject: Re: DG: Origins Part III I liked the laurels particularly ... no, the bit about Flying Polyps being the basis for Kukulcan especially, particularly as Kukulcan was (I believe) associated with the winds, keeping in mind the Polyps' weapon. Now onto further comments. > I wrote about Dr.Zahi Hawass who banned certain archeologists who > claimed to find underground tunnel networks under the pyramids and > Sphinx. He's working for Omar Shakti. Shakti knows about trapped polyps. > He also hopes to find some Yithian records about controlling them. With > an army of Polyps, he thinks he can kick Alzis' ass. "Zahi Hawass" is just a little too similar a name to Aiwass (Aiwaz), the spirit which dictated The Book Of The Law to our old friend Mr. Crowley. Aiwass, which coincidentally appeared in Cairo. Aiwass, which according to some sources was an avatar of Nyarlathotep. But maybe Dr. Hawass isn't really the avatar in this bunch. Maybe it's Shakti. But Alzis is (possibly) an avatar, too, and Shakti's mission to destroy a fellow avatar strengthens our earlier speculations about rivalries between the 9,999 forms. BTW, I see there's been yet another quake in Turkey. Not as bad as the other one, but pretty major nonetheless. What's going on here, with quakes in Turkey and (if I understood correctly) Greece? Is Atlantis/Thera preparing to resurface, thereby signalling the stars to be almost right? Andrew D. Gable agable@falcon.lhup.edu THE CRYPTOWEB: come.to/the_cryptoweb/ DELTA GREEN/EQUINOX: www.fortunecity.com/roswell/arkham/80/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 12:29:16 -0400 From: Bruce Ballon Subject: DG: RE: stranger than fiction Hello all, David Ickle is actually going to speak here in Toronto. For some reason, although every otehr venue has cancelled his talks as they have been determined to be pure Hate Literature, U of T says its Freedom of Speech. Ickle was tossed out of the Green party as according to them he was pure racist. He damaged their credibility and he was expunged. Ickle has adpated the infamous 'Elder Zion' stuff (re: the Nazi propaganda indicating Jews were ruling the Earth, giving them motives to do a Final Solution (amongst other stuff)).....into the Elder Zions were in league with a bunch of Space Aliens, giving the world over to them etc. i.e. kook. There is going to be a major demonstration by antiracist groups, the green aprty etc at the talk here. I'll let anyone know if the Greys show up. Bruce - -----Original Message----- From: Ian Gorlick [mailto:igorlick@nortelnetworks.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 1999 11:22 AM To: Delta Green List Subject: DG: stranger than fiction I just clipped this from my local newspaper: " David Icke ... was once a high-profile television sports-caster and spokesman for Britain's Green Party. Now he's a conspiracy theorist of the highest order. He is currently touring North America promoting his latest book, The Biggest Secret, which claims the British Royal Family, the Rothschild banking family, and U.S. presidents like George Bush are all descendants of extra-terrestrial reptiles conspiring to rule the world. Mr. Bush, former British prime minister Ted Heath and others have even been seen shape-shifting into their real reptilian identities, according to Mr. Icke." (Has this guy been discussed on the DGML before?) He's obviously a bit confused. We know that the Serpent-Men are native to this planet, not extra-terrestrials. But could he be correct about how widely they have infiltrated the corridors of power? Has he mixed up the activities of the Serpent-Men and the Shan? What's going on between the Serpent-Men and the Shan in Britain? Are they co-operating or are they slugging it out in secret? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 18:20:06 +0200 From: Davide Mana Subject: Re: DG: Shan Question (Possible Countdown Spoiler) Greetings. Just a wildd idea off the top of my head (rather appropriate) about Peter's question >Why don't they simply use a Gate spell, one end tethered at Goatswood, the other at Lgggyyyyyxxxx then shove their templeship through on a transporter? > >They don't have such a spell? That I don't buy as they have the resources of PISCES, Severn Aerospace and an Azathoth power source at their disposal. They could get access to one readily enough. Some weird physical reason? If that were the case they could simply ride a human host through the gate. > >Anyone come up with a satisfactory explanation? > >Thoughts? Note: I'm still waiting for COUNTDOWN, so maybe the following's contradicting some essential points. In this case, just trash the message and good riddance. This said, my idea is... Shans can't Gate. They are (at least this is what I was led to believe) made in part at least of "something completely different" (Pythonium? - once again, appropriate, considering they're operating out of England). This weird ultramundane stuff that makes up at least some vital bits of the shan's what prevents them to go through a gate - the gate teleports everything else but not the Pythonium bits. And/Or it just plain kills the shan. How comes? Well, maybe the gate transfers you from here to there by converting your mundane matter into Pythoniun (that's clearly not boud by our everyday phisiscs) and then back once you reach destination. But if you feed it rough Pythonium, the gate simply crashes. Here, just half-serious speculation. Take care! Davide Mana Torino, Italy doctor.dee@iol.it The Ice Cave - http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine/leiber/50/ice_cave.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 12:41:28 -0400 (EDT) From: "Andrew D. Gable" Subject: Re: DG: stranger than fiction Possibly the conspiracy theorists just have it wrong (wow! that would be a shocker!). I've dealt with this idea of the "Saurians" and Serpent Men in my own campaign, and I've come to the conclusion that the Valusians are, indeed, to blame, but the theorists just think they're extraterrestrial. Their infiltration of governments is within the realm of possibility, given "The Shadow Kingdom" by REH, where began to overtake the Kingdom of Valusia. But most Serpent Men today are degraded, and will probably lack any real power. Although an Imperial Serpent Man could still pose a threat... It's also possible that the Lloigor are responsible for some parts of Saurian mythology. BTW, on a sort of related note, I've seen a theory stating that the US is still part of the British Empire, and that the Revolutionary War never really happened, it was all an act put on by the two Georges (being Washington and King). Yeah, that's what I said, too. Andrew D. Gable agable@falcon.lhup.edu THE CRYPTOWEB: come.to/the_cryptoweb/ DELTA GREEN/EQUINOX: www.fortunecity.com/roswell/arkham/80/ > He's obviously a bit confused. We know that the Serpent-Men are native to > this planet, not extra-terrestrials. But could he be correct about how > widely they have infiltrated the corridors of power? > > Has he mixed up the activities of the Serpent-Men and the Shan? > > What's going on between the Serpent-Men and the Shan in Britain? Are they > co-operating or are they slugging it out in secret? > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 12:04:05 -0500 From: "C.O. Christopher" Subject: DG: Update, Delta-Green.com - -|- DELTA GREEN SECURE SERVER v24.6 -|- FILE VIEWER 3.2 -|- PGP CODING ENABLED -|- TO: Agents and Case Officers FROM: Christopher DATE: October 05, 1999 The following articles have been added to the Delta Green web server this month: Case History ADG.DM-0325, "Chasing the Bride" Case History ADG.JT-0301, "Das Totenreich" An update in Case History ADG.MM-107, "Forrest Lawn" Three new surveillance stills of cell "O", including agents Orion, Othello, and Ophelia. Full documentation and complete debriefing transcripts in Report #3270, OPERATION: SANDMAN. Complete debriefing transcripts in a report-in-progress, entitled "PX Poker Night." New HUMINT assets: "Trotsky's Page" and "DeltaGreen.dk". The next update is scheduled for November 1, 1999. Reports should be sent to christopher@delta-green.com as soon as they are ready. be seeing you, Christopher ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 13:06:45 -0700 From: Jeff Ewing Subject: Re: DG: RE: stranger than fiction At 12:29 PM 10/5/99 -0400, you wrote: >Ickle has adpated the infamous 'Elder Zion' stuff (re: the Nazi propaganda >indicating Jews were ruling the Earth, Steady on! The _Protocols_ are probably the most successful disinformation coup of the Ohkrana, the Tsarist Secret police, operating in conjunction with the Synod of Moscow. Original date of publication: 1901. An odd bit of trivia: the Protocols are actually what we would call today a "rant" against Napoleon III, purporting to be his credo. The authors merely switched the word "Zion" for "France," a task which must've been a lot tougher pre-word processing. Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 13:28:27 -0400 From: graemep@immagene.mcg.edu (Graeme Price) Subject: Re: DG: stranger than fiction Rob wrote: >Ah back to Mr Icke the erstwhile son of God. I'm sure he's been >covered in the list before. He was a BBC sports reporter who >suddenly decided that he was the Son of God and spent a few >years in a (I think it was purple) shell suit. Haven't heard much of >him in the UK recently. I think Graeme has mentioned him on the >list before now, Haven't seen anything about shapeshifting reptiles >though. Indeed I have. Total loon. Actually, it was a turquoise shell suit with purple stripes (The Horror! The Horror!), but the reptile thing is a new one on me as well. Perhaps he's seen one too many episodes of "V"? Later Graeme graemep@immag.mcg.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 14:17:21 -0300 From: "Diego Garcia" Subject: Re: DG: Shan Question (Possible Countdown Spoiler) Daniel Harms wrote: > Or not. I was actually talking over this issue with some friends >the other day. A number of different species - including the >Yithians and the Elder Things - don't seem to have any sort of gate >technology (save a reference or two to temporal gates for the ETs). >This either means that a) gate technology is not as common as we have >been led to think, or b) there's some sort of long-term problem with >gate tech that humans haven't figured out (e.g. Project QUAKE). Three possible problems with gate technology could be the following: a)Gates are not only a connection betweeen two points in space-time but are also connected with a "higher dimension" (that is the most plausible scientific explanation for a gate). One possible visitor that could be attracted by an open gate is a hound of tindalos, and I dont't know if a risk like this is worth the trouble for a shan or an ET. b)The cost for have really precision in creating the gate is too high to be really practical in great scale. c)That the connection with this higher dimension creates deformations in our own space-time that could be really dangerous ( I remeber now a page about free energy in wich it was explained in detail how to build an antigravity generator .The guy who wrote the page said that any error is extremely dangerous and can warp our space breaking the walls or the roof and possibly killing the operator) When you metion "project QUAKE" ,is the one in the Quake computer game?(appears in a txt in the quake game) >It may even be that those who >have it are keeping it secret from the others, to maintain their >status or as an ace in the hole. This is also a good explanation because the power to create gates is soething that needs a great responsibility.No one wants someone to be toying with everyone space time.Perhaps to use a gate spell you need a "gate user license" signed by Yog-Sothoth :-). END OF TRANSMISSION. Diego Garcia. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 10:24:40 -0700 From: Phil A Posehn Subject: Re: DG: Earthquakes and the Mythos Thanks for reminding me of that. Boy will my players shit when the terra cotta legions come marching out of the tomb! Phil (chuckling evilly) On Mon, 4 Oct 1999 20:28:31 -0400 (EDT) The Man in Black writes: >On Mon, 27 Sep 1999, Jimmie Bise, Jr. wrote: . And they have a lot of secret archeology, like the tomb >of >the first emperor (the one with the terra cotta warriors) that Dan >"the >Man" Harms will explain presently. > ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 10:16:32 -0700 From: Phil A Posehn Subject: DG: Re: SDI Why not just build a few Tesla Coils instead? Phil Posehn On Mon, 4 Oct 1999 09:17:29 +0900 "David Farnell" writes: >From: Jimmie Bise, Jr. >> Okay, I'm guessing here that the official line is that "The Cold War >may >be >> over, but that doesn't mean that there are still countries hostile >to the >> United States that have Intercontinental Nuclear capability". North >Korea >> springs immediately to mind. > >Yes, and for that purpose, I sure wouldn't mind having a few of those >of >those anti-missile missiles over here (Fukuoka being the closest major >city >to the Korean Peninsula). OTOH, everything I've read says the failure >rate >is still much too high for us to be depending on such a system. And if >I was >going to do a little nuclear terrorism on the USA, I'd just stick a >bomb in >a crate on a freighter bound for New York City. But then, I always get >low >points when I play "Before I Kill You, Mister Bond..." > >I like the MJ-12 explanation better. > >Dave > > > > ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------ End of deltagreen-digest V2 #91 *******************************