From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of James Holloway [j_holloway26@hotmail.com] Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 1:37 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Re: Shroud > >I always thought the image might have been imprinted by chemical reactions >with the sweat of a human body. Of course, the whole thing is a locus of >infinite loony speculation. But Cosmic Energy? More likely ammonia. Weirdness dynamic duo Picknett and Prince released a book not too long ago connecting the whole thing to (who else) the Templars and claiming that (IIRC) the Shroud is a forgery made by Leonardo da Vinci. Nice. The thing that always bugged me about the shroud is that you'd think the gospels would mention that Jesus was six foot six. "He was the Son of God ... and he was HUGE! I mean BIG! Ate all them loaves and fishes by himself! And walkin' on water - don't you believe it. He just walked along the bottom with his head comin' out the top." -- James Holloway "And yet in the end, for all his pains, he only knows how to play a game." - Baldesar Castiglione, "The Book of the Courtier" ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Davide Mana [doctor.dee@libero.it] Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 2:11 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Re: Shroud Greetings. On the subject of the Shroud - a relic about which we feel a bit proprietorial here in Turin - the Glove Cleaner writes > >I remember 'way back in the early 80's checking out the Catholic claims >about the Shroud. I'm fairly sure this will have been discussed on list >but apparently they claim 1) it records an anatomically accurate crucifixion >(nails through wrist bones, not palm) 2) it isn't painted. > >I always thought the image might have been imprinted by chemical reactions >with the sweat of a human body. Of course, the whole thing is a locus of >infinite loony speculation. But Cosmic Energy? More likely ammonia. OK, time to show-off my freshly acquired wisdom. Point one is fairly exact - the shroud does show the picture (both back and front) of a man that suffered crucifixion. That's a fact. The picture is photorealistic, and the details do match historical data about standard crucifixion (there's a doc in the Cave about that). Who the subject was is open to speculation. _If_ the radiocarbon dating is right (and it might well be, IMHO), this is eight century stuff. So he was not JC, but the technical quiz remains. Point two now... It is not painted, no. It is a negative image - like in photography: the lighter areas on the subject are the darkest on the Shroud. This was discovered quite a few decades ago. What I learned the other night is _how_ this is achieved. Follow me, as it is damn weird - it would cause my players to crawl up the walls with foreboding. So, the Shroud is a linen sheet. It was woven using a linen thread composed of sixteen interwoven fibres. The negative image shows seventeen shades of colour, from light ivory (=unaltered) to dark brown. Each step in the gradation ladder means one of the single fibres got dark, while the other remained unaltered. Therefore clear - 16 unaltered fibres medium - 8 brown fibres, 8 unaltered fibres extreme dark - 16 dark fibres In other words, whatever caused the darkening did not act on the sheet as a whole, or on the thread as a whole, staining it a deeper or lighter shade of brown, but simply 'burned' a higher or lower number of fibres in the thread. It's a plain binary thing - either the fibre is brown or it is light yellow. It's an on/off alternative. So, I'll spell this out - it's a photographic negative, and it's... digital? This is what is causing researchers to get mad - a plain chemical reaction is the obvious answer, but what frigging chemical reaction acts selectively like that? And here I stop for the time being. Sorry for the lecture. Take care. Davide Mana Torino, Italy doctor.dee@libero.it The Ice Cave - http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine/leiber/50/ice_cave.htm From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Andy Robertson [andywrobertson@clara.co.uk] Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 2:20 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Cartoon lust ----- Original Message ----- From: > Do you see any common themes in them, some distinctive aspect that imprinted > you, some parallel? What are the lessons they teach? In the DG world. Always > always in the DG world. > Duh. Glove Cleaners aren't sensitive to this sort of thing you know, we are very very literal. FX I'm too slow to tell if you are really asking or really not really asking. So. Violence counts for nothing Nothing ever changes (Scooby-do) the supernatural is not real in any way. Chills. I just remembered the Outer Limits, or was it Twilight Zone, with the omnipotent spoiled kid. "I'm sending you to Sunday Morning Cartoon Land . . . . .. " The Glove Cleaner From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Popeyesays@aol.com Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 2:21 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Damn kekboard In a message dated 3/31/00 2:37:33 PM Central Standard Time, LizardRoi@aol.com writes: << Kou think kou got problems, this whole "Y to K" business has been a non-stop headache since the beginning of the kear. Kou would think those MIS people would have fixed this bk now. I put a call in last Mondak and I haven't gotten a response ket. And I thought that Help Desk person was verk rude. Kours trulk, Mark McFadden I figure part of the problem was not choosing a vowel *or* a consonant but settling for a compromise. >> b** * h*v* n* v*w*ls *t *ll *nd h*v* t*o s*bs*it*t* * "8" From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Michael Layne [theherald@hotmail.com] Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 2:37 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Re: TRADECRAFT: ultralights and such On 30 March 2000 AD, graemep@immagene.mcg.edu (Graeme Price) said, regarding the DG UltraLight Strike Fighter Program: >One scenario no one has considered: Microlight vs. >Byakhee/Nightguant/Shantak etc. Still seem like a good idea? Given that scenario, I think I'd trade my UltraLight Strike Fighter in on a Rocket Pack! (Although I don't want a fin like the Rocketeer's on _my_ helmet!) I could still carry about the same amount of personal ordnance, would be just as vulnerable, and would present a smaller target... Of course, if I've time to prepare and the resources available, I'd prefer an OH-58D Kiowa Warrior -- painted black, so if any news services take photos of the battle, it will be considered "just another Black Helicopter", and thus MJ-12 will be blamed for any property damage inflicted by Shantak talons or errant Hydra-70 FFAR rockets...:) Or, a compromise between the ULSF and the OH-58D -- "Little Nelly", the armed Wallis Autogyro (which, with the original version of Agent 007 at the controls, shot down four S.P.E.C.T.R.E. helicopters over Japan in the movie version of "You Only Live Twice")? While you can't put the Wallis Autogyro in the trunk of a car (as you can the Rocket Pack), the machine used in the Bond movie allegedly could be disassembled into a few man-portable packages, and carried in a pickup truck. Michael DGGF#688 theherald@hotmail.com (Did you ever notice that James Bond looks kind of young for someone allegedly born before WWII? And that not only has he remained young, but his appearance has changed at least four times (Connery, Lazenby, Moore, Brosnan)? A mutant product of Mi-Go Experiments during the early part of the 20th century? The Infinity Formula (tm)? An undiscovered relative of Lazarus Long? A "Stealth Immortal", immune to detection or The Quickening? An exiled Time-Lord (which would explain Bond's "Regenerations")?):) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of EdDrWho@aol.com Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 3:02 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Re: TRADECRAFT: ultralights and such In a message dated 4/1/00 2:41:09 PM Central Standard Time, theherald@hotmail.com writes: > An undiscovered relative of > Lazarus Long? As if I didn't hate him enough already... From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Edgar Riceboro [rlyehswimmer@angelfire.com] Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 10:58 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Cartoon lust On Sun, 02 Apr 2000 00:48:53 Davide Mana wrote: >SNIP> >So, DG-wise... >Tightly-plotted series excepted, most American cartoons tend to show a highly coreographed violence. It's rather funny that US-based filmmakers had to wait for John Woo to show them how it's done, as you can see how it's done in most Tom&Jerry cartoons. Not to mention Popeye classics! The music and the action are one the function of the other. >Controlled chaos as a ballet Wandering off topic but I have to defend two of the (IMHO) greats... You mention John Woo as the coreographer of violence who helped the yanks see the light...but remember lines such as: "Every gun plays its own tune....and this one has perfect timing." from the Good, the Bad, and the Ugly. Consider also that several of Leone's (sp?) movies were heavily influenced by his contemporary Kurosawa. Both were early masters of the art of conflict as cinema (not even going to wander into the predator-prey relationships of Woo-sa). Need more be said? Kurosawa, dealing with sword-bearing protagonists, used the emphasis of beat-based timing to his action sequences (a fundamental principle Musashi very plainly hinted at in his famous work dealing with sword play and which was later reinforced by the ill-fated Bruce Lee). Alot of the great works have a coreography to them that makes the action seem artful, this was best explained to me by an aspiring artist who said the best example was that of nature. On the plains a young lion must struggle with its prey; the older lion can accomplish the same result with but a single attack. This fascination with and natural tempo to our violence could be something that we were "designed" with or it could be a mystery that those not native to this sphere may find intriguing in their own non-sensical ways. However, as romantic as it is, as dramatic as it seems, real violence is a thirty second commercial at best. -ER Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Daniel Harms [dmharms@acsu.buffalo.edu] Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 10:48 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Mi-Go Deviousness At 11:25 AM 4/1/2000 -0500, Steven Kaye wrote: >At 4:52 AM -0500 4/1/00, EdDrWho@aol.com wrote: >>In an ephiphanous missive dated 4/1/00 3:51:26 AM Central Standard Time, >>forvalaka@juno.com reminded us: >> > Come on guys, you can over-think this stuff, ya know. >>Thank you. Someone had to say it. >Really? Why? Because it contradicts the sourcebook? I think that's it. It's odd that no one else's post on this thread has attracted such antipathy. But this ambiguity is part of Lovecraft's work. For example, in "The Call of Cthulhu" itself, we never see Cthulhu. We never get anywhere near him. At one point, we're hearing lore of the Old Ones given to the deathless Chinamen, who give it to a degenerate sailor/cultist, who gives it to a police detective, who gives it to Professor Angell, who gives it to Francis Wayland Thurston, who gives it to the reader! We have no assurances that one of the people along that chain isn't lying... It's interesting the way that the context of a piece changes our views toward it. If any of you had first read "Whisperer" in a book of "true alien encounters", you would have probably not believed it. Get a few propsman and someone to write the Akeley letters, and it could have probably duplicated it in a few days. However, since the piece is fiction, we are much more willing to suspend disbelief and accept the mi-go's existence, even though there is nothing in the tale which is direct evidence of this. Of course, it does contradict much of the material written afterwards. Here, I only speak to what HPL writes in the story itself. ObDG: Most people approach such material with an edge of trust. The more layers between the players and first-hand knowledge of a subject, the more likely that some mistakes fill in, either unintentionally or otherwise. Exploit it - especially if the players keep using that old professor to translate their books... ;-) Yrs., Daniel Harms dmharms@acsu.buffalo.edu The Internet: Learn what you know. Share what you don't. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Daniel Harms [dmharms@acsu.buffalo.edu] Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 10:20 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: The Order of the Garter At 01:53 PM 4/1/2000 -0500, you wrote: >You've managed to duplicate a significant portion of the back story for >"Lammas Night", a 1983 novel by Katherine Kurtz. >To simplify - a connection between witches and the British kings has existed >since, at least, the Norman invasion. There's a druidic / pagan connection >so occasionally someone has to play the role of the Summer King. Of course, I think Kurtz got it in turn from the works of the folklorist Margaret Murray, especially her _God of the Witches_. In that book (published some time in the Thirties), Murray suggested that the king of England (or a suitable scapegoat, such as Archbishop Thomas a Becket), was killed every seven years as part of a pagan ritual which kept the land fertile. This ritual was carried out quietly by a secret society which was made up of witches, and which had ties to the faerie folk (who were actually Britain's prehistoric inhabitants). ObDG: And you thought Pisces was bad... Yrs., Daniel Harms dmharms@acsu.buffalo.edu The Internet: Learn what you know. Share what you don't. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 1:09 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: It's a GOOD life. (spoilers) In a message dated 4/1/00 3:59:56 PM Pacific Standard Time, box_nine@ix.netcom.com writes: << >Chills. I just remembered the Outer Limits, or was it Twilight Zone, with >the omnipotent spoiled kid. "I'm sending you to Sunday Morning Cartoon >Land . . . . .. " TWILIGHT ZONE: THE MOVIE, based on the classic "It's a Good Life," by Jerome Bixby. >> Bixby's short story is an icon. The TV interpretation on the original series starred Billy Mumy as Anthony, was framed in an arresting manner and haunted me for years. To start, Rod Serling took a throwaway line from the story and pushed it to the front in his intro. The town is all on it's own, at the edge of town *reality* sort of dissolves into...nothing. Whether this is because Anthony took the town away, or made everything else go away is unknown and moot. The situation is Anthony likes it this way and there is not much anyone can do about it. For everyone who is familiar with the episode in the movie but hasn't seen the B&W TV episode, make a note to seek out the original. They are not different takes on the same story, the movie sequence is almost a sequel to the TV episode seen through a glass lightly. SPOILERS SPOILERS gonna give away endings In the TV version, Anthony is a child. In the movie he is an adolescent. In the TV version, Anthony is essentially a savage, he goes as he wills, does as he wills, the only sort of influence you can exert on him is creative pleading. And you better live the lie because he reads minds. He is a child with an Id that can command gratification, an indifferent Ego and not much sign of a Superego. Luckily, he still likes his parents when they don't annoy him. The situation at the end of the TV episode is the stuff of nightmares: the Jack-in-the-Box is sent to the cornfield, the hysterical new widow is being restrained and muffled by friends and neighbors who are trying to keep her from annoying Anthony as the neighbor who plays piano strikes up a happy tune to get Anthony in a good mood. Anthony's father looks outside at the newfallen snow; which Anthony made because he vaguely wanted to see some; that will easily kill half of their meager crops. He grimly gathers himself and then 'it's showtime'. "But it's good that you made it snow like that Anthony. Real good. It's a good life." In the "sequel" segment of the Twilight Zone movie {you know the infamous cursed film that killed Vic Morrow and two children.} he meets a schoolteacher (Kathleen Quinlan) while visiting the outside world and gets her to take him home. Anthony apparently got annoyed with everyone over time, his world has been scaled down to a remote house and strangers he has taken hostage and forced into taking the roles of family members. This is key; he can usually make anything he wants, but now he wants something he can only get from other people. He can't make them give it because that's just fake, and he doesn't know how to inspire them to give it. He also doesn't know what it is. Notice that in the original, everyone wanted to please Anthony just as the hostage "family" does, but now it is Anthony who wants to please the teacher. Stuff happens, Anthony gets annoyed and everything goes away except for Anthony and the teacher. She tells him that he has great power, but he is inexperienced and doesn't know how to use it. And he should be careful because the power could be dangerous if he doesn't know how to control it, but she thinks she can teach him how to control it if he will let her. He brings the world back and they drive off together (with the teacher at the wheel) into the sunrise as flowers bloom. That was the surface. Look closer. When Anthony makes the world go away (notice that he did not take *them* away, he made everything else give them the room for a minute) she seems profoundly effected. Her eyes become heavy lidded, her lips part slightly and we can see in closeups that she is misting, she is in fact, uh, moist. Then she snaps out of it and is in control of the whole situation. She walks like an instructor, with hands behind her back. She circles Anthony while talking, even breaking his personal space and putting her face next to his, but from behind him, breathing her words into his ear. Notice her choice of words. I don't have the script at hand, so I'll paraphrase: I know how you feel. I know what you're going through. I can help. You have a gift, a power. But watch out, it might get bigger than you can handle by yourself. I can help. I can show you how to use it properly. Will you let me be your teacher, and student? He brings the world back and they drive off together (with the teacher at the wheel) into the sunrise as flowers bloom. Ewige Blumenkraft. (1) When we see the world in bloom, did Anthony bring the world back, or did he recreate the world in a better mood? Do you think maybe they'll Feed the Lions, Ride the Griffin, attempt the Marriage of Rose and Cross? It was directed by Joe Dante. Anyhow, that's my psychosexual spin on the obvious handiwork of the Secret Chiefs. Sidebar: Years later, while watching that Oliver Stone movie about that pretender to the Crown, Kathleen Quinlan again taught a lesson. Things are limp in Lizardland and she tells that pathetic poser about how things were done in the Olde Days when women were running things. Before the men who were afraid of menstruation and moon magick took over by fire and sword and the concept of slavery. She recommends going back to basics, and they do. She is nude, dancing like a Bacchante in a loft apartment as rain beats down on the skylights and lightning flashes as the Carmina Burana tells us of the larger world as she is chased by a man with antlers. And I think, "Which gods did I please recently? Tell me so I can please them some more." Mark McFadden (1) Incidentally, the land-returning-to-life motif was also used in Excalibur as Arthur, healed, rides toward his destiny with Modred. Three guesses what music is playing on the soundtrack. For details on the Twilight Zone deaths, see "Hollywood Hex: death and destiny in the dream factory. An illustrated history of cursed movies" by Mikita Brottman ISBN 1 871592 85 2. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 1:08 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: More on the Twilight Zone Move (not OT) AND, to add to the cartoon thread: The Joe Dante segment of the movie also gave me something else to ponder. I first saw it at a bargain theater, one of those suburban mall-on-the-decline theaters where you get double features at low low prices but families with infants and toddlers are the majority of the audience. Hey, you get the viewing experience you pay for. So everyone seems to be enjoying the show. Dan Ackroyd going boogabooga got a few cries, but they all settled quickly. The explosions and violence of the John Landis segment didn't get a reaction, the Steven Spielberg segment wasn't scary in the first place - then the Joe Dante "Anthony" segment. Everything goes smoothly until Anthony sends his "sister" to Cartoonland. She appears on TV and the underside of Toontown appears and it's residents say they've been waiting for her. Pandemonium. Almost every toddler in the theater *freaked*, I mean as in hysterics. Over a dozen families had to leave the theater immediately with their terrified child(ren) in their arms. Apparently, the idea of going to Cartoonland isn't that appealing to younger folk. Why? Scaring the Kiddies: A Tale of Terror a) The children are frightened at a primal level for the same reasons children say "Don't be a monster" when you make a scarey face. It is the transformation from familiar and trusted to alien and malign that disturbs them. b) Cartoons present the surreal every day. It's very nature is a growth medium for Yellow Rot. Surely it must get to the creators after awhile. Those that aren't effected copy the methods of those who produce effective, striking work. Most of the classic cartoons were not made for children, they were made for the entertainment of adults at movie theaters. They were repackaged for television as children's entertainment, and then new ones were made for the new market. Hanna and Barbera pioneered ways of reducing the cel overhead to allow profitably producing enough new cartoons to keep up with weekly TV programming, and a new chapter began. c) Don't kid yourself about this occult mumbo jumbo, but don't make the mistake of thinking it's all random and serendipitous and accidentally playing on primal themes. Cartoons come from entertainment capitalists, animation wasn't cheap when it all had to be done by hand by skilled labor. When the country went to war, the cartoons were active on the home front. Psychops entered the picture and never really left. Now They have a more varied agenda than winning a (public) war and the factions with a finger in the pie are hard to pin down and constantly changing in any case. Cartoon content is now influenced by FCC regulations and parents groups and religious groups and network executives and input from the Retail division about what dolls\action figures sell best and what their surveys say the audience wants. Any or all of these factors may be fronts, puppets, or useful idiots. Some may be counter conspiracies. The animators roll their eyes and try to work around those memos from the pinheads upstairs. {so why do the cartoons frighten as well as entertain? For the same reason young males were given a stoned Magical Mystery Tour of the secret cave paintings lit by flickering flame making the pictures seem to move as the scarey figure in animal skins told them what was expected from them as men before he cut their penis, reinforcing the learning experience. Fear imprints the lesson. Fnord.} Sidebar: An example of the horror of the surreal in cartoons. A Heckle and Jeckyl cartoon began with the two crows lamenting their lot in life. Then one has a Mentos Moment and realizes that they are cartoon characters and not limited by physics or causality or the laws of Man or God. They go on a rampage doing as they Wilt. Oddly (oe then again, maybe not), for something that gave me the feys and vapors as a child, I cannot remember how it ends. When I'm "awake". During the Joe Dante segment, one of the omnipresent cartoons playing on the numerous TVs was that very Heckle and Jeckyl cartoon, the scene where they have their epiphany. Mark McFadden Is really grateful to have access to a forum where this stuff is germane to the discussion. Thank you Pagans. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 1:20 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Mi-Go Deviousness In a message dated 4/1/00 8:51:53 PM Pacific Standard Time, dmharms@acsu.buffalo.edu writes: << ObDG: Most people approach such material with an edge of trust. The more layers between the players and first-hand knowledge of a subject, the more likely that some mistakes fill in, either unintentionally or otherwise. Exploit it - especially if the players keep using that old professor to translate their books... ;-) >> And don't forget the lesson in the game of Telephone. Even when trying to accurately repeat a message, the more links in the chain the more distorted the message when it comes out the other end. Mark McFadden From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of DocHopt@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 1:50 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Interrogations, Legal and Otherwise box_nine@ix.netcom.com writes: << Note that sodium pentothal relaxes the subject - it does not render the subject 'truthful' per se. Polygraphs are notoriously unreliable. >> Again, still behind in email... yep, sodium pen isn't a 'truth' drug per se, but it makes it harder for the subject to distinguish between people he should and shouldn't tell things to. Thus you have subjects telling interrogators about past affairs they had or how good that hooker was last night. (Should make for some interesting RP...) Also, polygraphs -do- register the physical effects of emotions, most notably the 'fight or flight' adrenaline reflex, but they -don't- register the exact causes of info, so they're at best circumstantal evidence. Hopt Son of a doctor and lawyer. Oh my. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Andy Robertson [andywrobertson@clara.co.uk] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 3:25 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Mi-Go Deviousness ----- Original Message ----- From: Daniel Harms > >> > Come on guys, you can over-think this stuff, ya know. > > >>Thank you. Someone had to say it. > > >Really? Why? Because it contradicts the sourcebook? > > I think that's it. It's odd that no one else's post on this thread has > attracted such antipathy. Agreed re the antipathy - but I think people like me, who so love the intoxication of THINKING, must regularly bow the neck and acknowledge that theory is secondary to real infomation. Field experience posted here is 300% more valuable than my empty speculation. I say it loud! The Glove Cleaner From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Davide Mana [doctor.dee@libero.it] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 3:40 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Mi-Go Deviousness Greetings. >It's interesting the way that the context of a piece changes our views >toward it. If any of you had first read "Whisperer" in a book of "true >alien encounters", you would have probably not believed it. Get a few >propsman and someone to write the Akeley letters, and it could have >probably duplicated it in a few days. Am I the only one that wonders why Mr Harms is so eager to convince us that there are no traces of real Mi-Go activity in the Wilmarth report? What did they promise you, Daniel - eternal life in a silver brainbox and the opportunity to travel through space? Is that enough to betray your own species? But after all, we never actually saw him, right? And sure he knows a LOT about the Mythos.... Davide 'Not Paranoid Enough?' Mana From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Davide Mana [doctor.dee@libero.it] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 3:34 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Cartoon lust Greetings. I agree this is OT, so just a fast one to plead innocent.... >Wandering off topic but I have to defend two of the (IMHO) greats... > > You mention John Woo as the coreographer of violence who helped the yanks see the light...but remember lines such as: > "Every gun plays its own tune....and this one has perfect timing." from the Good, the Bad, and the Ugly. > Consider also that several of Leone's (sp?) movies were heavily influenced by his contemporary Kurosawa. [snippage] You forget Peckinpah.... ;> Anyway - the origin of action coreography was not an issue in my post. I simply wanted to underline that the average cartoon director from what... the thirties or forties, had more sense of dynamics than most contemporary (or later) movie directors. As for Sergio Leone and Akira Kurosawa - of course, I cannot but agree. You incidentally mention two of my favourites (and probably my favourite Italian director). We could go on forever trying to decide if they actually did leave a mark in contemporary (that is 50s/60s/70s) American cinema. >However, as romantic as it is, as dramatic as it seems, real violence is a thirty second commercial at best. Agreed. And when the man with the gun meets the man with the rifle, the man with the gun is a dead man. Cheers! Davide Mana From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Philip A Posehn [paposehn@juno.com] Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 7:33 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Family tree Not necesarrily. The Oneida community practiced selective breeding with a view toward improving the species. Of the 50+ children produced, NONE died in infancy. This at a time when the infant mortality rate ran around 10%. The remnants of the membership founded the Oneida Silverware company and were the first settlers of Orange County Calif. For More info. see "Without Sin; The history of the Oneida Community". Phil On Sun, 2 Apr 2000 00:55:25 +0100 "Andy Robertson" writes: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Philip A Posehn > > > Was he related to John Humphery Noyes who started theOneida > community > > about 150 yeard later in upstate New York? > > http://www.nyhistory.com/central/oneida.htm > > "The founder of the Oneida Community was John Humphrey Noyes. He was > born in > Brattleboro, Vermont, in 1811". > > The Oneida originally started in Putney, Vermont, prime mi-go > territory, but > later fled west. > > Communal living, prohibition of pair-bonding, multi-partner sex > relations in > a complex and controlled form, virgins introduced to same at > fourteen, what > looks like an incompetent New England form of Tantra, "Mutual > criticism". > > Maybe The Oneida were just religious nutters. They broke up in 1881 > - and > it's likely enough that the person who called himself Noyes in "The > Whisperer In Darkness" was not a member of JH Noyes' family (whether > or not > this JH Noyes is related to our agent Noyes) and was adapting a > local name > as pseudonym . . . > > It's an interesting linkage. But too far in the past now for us to > wring > any tactical advantage out of it, even if it's true, I suppose . . > . . > > > > The Glove Cleaner > > ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of DocHopt@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 5:46 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: Neotissue in 'Wired'? >From the April issue of 'Wired': "THE FLESHMAKER "Human skin is a well-knit fabric of collagen fibers whose structure gives the organ its strength and flexibility. But cut more than skin-deep, the injured flesh mends itself with scar tissue, a grow-quick layer that's stiff and fragile. Now a British biotech firm is improving on the body's Bondo: Electrosols's spray-on mist coats a wound with biodegradable polymer fibers that normal skins cells adhere to. The sprayer uses an electrical field to distribute the fibers in the cross-weave of healthy tissue, laying a pattern for new skin to follow." This was accompanied by a 1000x pic of eerile -purple- skin cells. Note the "British biotech firm." According to the quip, the company that's developing this (Electrosols, www.electrosols.com) was founded in 1992. How long has the AoTE been around? I don't have 'Countdown' yet... possible link to the Greys/MJ-12? Hopt Who's never had a skin graft, thank you very much... From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 6:11 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Family tree In a message dated 4/2/00 2:15:52 AM Pacific Daylight Time, paposehn@juno.com writes: << The remnants of the membership founded the Oneida Silverware company and were the first settlers of Orange County Calif. >> I knew it! I just knew that life behind the Orange Curtain was skewed. The members of the present community still practice selective breeding with a view toward improving the species. When crosses burn around here it's usually in the 714 area code. Mark McFadden From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 6:11 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Cartoon lust In a message dated 4/2/00 1:46:51 AM Pacific Daylight Time, doctor.dee@libero.it writes: << And when the man with the gun meets the man with the rifle, the man with the gun is a dead man. >> That would be "Waterhole #3". James Coburn rocks. His bringing a rifle to a gunfight was a classic. To veer away from the OT abyss, let me add a bit about cartoon fight choreography in the US and one of the elements of why it looks as it does. Back when cartoon violence was the crisis du jour rather than mere pundit fodder, pressure from parents seeking to shirk responsibility made the FCC issue a Bull. Starting at about the time of He-Man and the other glandular heroes (IIRC) animators were forbidden from showing acts of violence that children could imitate. Therefore, He-Man could never punch Skeletor in the face, but he could lift a boulder the size of a Buick and throw it at him. But the FCC merely codified an unwritten set of guidelines that everyone was already following to varying degrees. That's why no one ever slaps Shaggy upside the head like the Skipper used to pimp slap Gilligan. No Moe's going Medieval on Stooge ass. Most head flattenings are now delivered by dropped anvil rather than the traditional mallet or frying pan. There are exceptions of course, but look for the elements that are added to make it something fast and surreal and irreproducible by children without access to cartoon physics. This, of course, only makes violence forbidden fruit. Oooooo, want to hear a cool torture? Mark McFadden Master of Race Bannon Do, the subset of jiu jitsu that involves no punches, kicks or chokes; just throwing the opponent repeatedly across the room and ending in either a knockout or an undetailed arm lock. Incidentally, does everyone know that "Race Bannon" is the nom de plume of a writer of guides to B&D? An in-joke at Hanna-Barbera was pencil studies of Race Bannon in various leather ensembles pinned up on numerous corkboards. Beyond the joke, I noticed that many many of the drawings were in the offices of female employees. No Velmas for the ladies. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Davide Mana [doctor.dee@libero.it] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 7:26 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Cartoon lust Greetings. It's sunday all over the world (or something like that) and Mark McFadden - still holding back the truth about mythos cartoons - wrote > Incidentally, does everyone know that "Race Bannon" is the nom de plume of a >writer of guides to B&D? An in-joke at Hanna-Barbera was pencil studies of >Race Bannon in various leather ensembles pinned up on numerous corkboards. >Beyond the joke, I noticed that many many of the drawings were in the offices >of female employees. No Velmas for the ladies. I do not know if this is another off the well-known McFadden's canon of urban legends, but sincronicity is here again. Last night, after posting the list about my fave Italian cartoon, I had a long chat with a good friend, who happens to be an explosives expert, a collector of TNT Team comics and a conspiracy theory/forteana afficionado. Anyway, we were talking about this weird bit about our childhood heroes being all the rage in Croatia - that's why I called him in the first place. He pointed out to me that there is a very grown up version of Velma - and that she had her very own, definitely X-rated series here in Italy in the '70s, once again thanks to our cartoonist of choice, Magnus. The series (which Magnus created to pay the rent) is called 'Necron', and features a character, Frieda Boher that _is_ Velma, glasses and all, with an evil glint in her eyes, hair cropped short and S&M bondage leather gear. A sort of surrealistic, horror/splatter Barbarella. Artwork from Magnus (including TNT and Necron) can be found here http://www.ubcfumetti.com/magnus/ The English version limps a bit here and there (the framesets are not finely tuned), but it's well worth a visit. Check the art galleries. And here I stop with my fanboy rants. Take care. Davide Mana From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 8:44 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Cartoon lust In a message dated 4/2/00 5:30:30 AM Pacific Daylight Time, doctor.dee@libero.it writes: << I do not know if this is another off the well-known McFadden's canon of urban legends, but sincronicity is here again. >> That would be telling. Be seeing you. Mark McFadden A few years ago, Hanna-Barbera abandoned their colorful Jetsonesque headquarters in Hollywood and moved to some floors in a generic building in Sherman Oaks, so I guess you'll never know for sure. We Hollywood history buffs want to keep the venerable buildings, some as much as *30 years old* as part of our ancient heritage, so the buildings still stand, but there is no Mystery Machine (a real van, honest!) in the parking lot any more. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 10:20 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Mi-Go Deviousness In a message dated 4/2/00 1:46:49 AM Pacific Daylight Time, doctor.dee@libero.it writes: << Am I the only one that wonders why Mr Harms is so eager to convince us that there are no traces of real Mi-Go activity in the Wilmarth report? What did they promise you, Daniel - eternal life in a silver brainbox and the opportunity to travel through space? Is that enough to betray your own species? But after all, we never actually saw him, right? And sure he knows a LOT about the Mythos.... Davide 'Not Paranoid Enough?' Mana >> Yes, who is Daniel Harms, really? I'm not sure I trust anyone with such encyclopedic Mythos knowledge. Since he writes to a mailing list rather than having homeless people come up to us to chat, I'm going to assume that he isn't yet another avatar. And besides, his name isn't an anagram for Nyarlathotep. So who is Daniel Harms? His Alderman? Let's see, his name claims he's "a dash Merlin" but he's also "a damn relish" Too passive. What does he tell us he is? "I'm a hard lens", is evocative. "I'm Andre Lash" has potential, but what are the odds of the editor of the Race Bannon B&D books being a tool of the Mythos? "I'm Sarah Lend" is straightforward and boring. "I'm Snarlhead" is good, sounds like a minor demon, maybe a buddy of Screwtape's. "I'm Alden Rash" is sort of....wait a minute "I'm rash laden" eeeeewwww! Perhaps he serves a mistress? "I'm Her sandal" "I'm as Her land." "I'm lad She ran." "I'm nasal herd" is just silly, even if rhino means nose. however, "I'm anal shred" is distinctly threatening. Mark McFadden And what am I to make of the fact that "scroggins" is breeder's slang for gerbil scrotums? It's true, I read it somewhere. I'll try to find the URL ;-P From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Andy Robertson [andywrobertson@clara.co.uk] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 11:02 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: Re: It's a GOOD life. (spoilers) ----- Original Message ----- From: > TWILIGHT ZONE: THE MOVIE, based on the classic "It's a Good Life," by > Jerome Bixby. >> Thanks (and to Steve Kaye, who mailed me info off-list). What I in fact saw (at a friend's house, drunk) was just a short segment, maybe a third, of the end of what by your description must have been the film version. I didn't know the title of it, and though I knew the Bixby story I never connected the two. > Bixby's short story is an icon. Affirmative. You describe it and the film very effectively. I guess I'll just have to get and watch the film and TV versions both. The |Glove Cleaner From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Andy Robertson [andywrobertson@clara.co.uk] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 11:23 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: Re: More on the Twilight Zone Move (not OT) ----- Original Message ----- From: > Everything goes smoothly until Anthony sends his "sister" to Cartoonland. > She appears on TV and the underside of Toontown appears and it's resid > say they've been waiting for her. Pandemonium. Almost every toddler in the > theater *freaked*, I mean as in hysterics. Over a dozen families had to lea > the theater immediately with their terrified child(ren) in their arms. > The poor little sods are born knowing that the world can turn into Hell, just by changing its expression. No-one needs to _learn_ that. But adults spend fifteen years of growing up convincing themselves it isn't so. Then some of them spend another fifteen years learning that it is so after all. The Glove Cleaner (ref: Charles Lamb quotation at start of "Dunwich Horror") From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Andy Robertson [andywrobertson@clara.co.uk] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 11:34 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: Re: Neotissue in 'Wired'? --- Original Message ----- From: > "Human skin is a well-knit fabric of collagen fibers whose structure gives > the organ its strength and flexibility. But cut more than skin-deep, the > injured flesh mends itself with scar tissue, a grow-quick layer that's stiff > and fragile. Now a British biotech firm is improving on the body's Bondo: > Electrosols's spray-on mist coats a wound with biodegradable polymer fibers > that normal skins cells adhere to. The stuff is sprayed on, so if neo-tissue is a "single lump" that does not retain its organisation when it is split up to microscopic sizes this should raise few alarms. However, this isn't really a field of expertise for me. Random thoughts. If Mi-Go tissue is "fungoid" it should be constructed, not of single cells with a nucleus at the core of each, but of long branching thread-like processes (hyphae) which have multiple nuclei along the axis. Attempts to incorporate something like this into human tissue, or to reconstruct human tissue into this form, should alert us. Only tentative ideas, sorry The Glove Cleaner From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Steven Kaye [box_nine@ix.netcom.com] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 11:51 AM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: More Thoughts on Cartoons Some cartoons that haven't come up, from my misspent youth: STAR BLAZERS - Earth gets hit with some sort of plague bombs, and our heroes have to travel to a distant galaxy (on a converted Japanese WWII battleship, the Yamato) to find a cure in time. Crew included the inevitable beautiful alien princess, the robot who was in love with said princess, a doctor who was always drinking glasses of water, a crusty old captain, and others I don't recall off hand. This was apparently the butchered-for-US release version of SPACE SHIP YAMATO - among the things changed to protect young innocents was that the doctor was an alcoholic (hence the constant drinking). I remember every episode ended with "Hurry Star Blazers! Earth has only [fill in the blank] days left!" G-FORCE: No idea what the original Japanese series title was - this involved a group of superheroes, fighting off nasty aliens from Planet Spectra while wearing silly white bird-motif outfits. There was the lovable slow-witted guy with a physique like a beer barrel, the rash young team leader (Mark), this other guy that seemed to stand around a lot and act moody (Jason), the Kate Moss-thin female, and this kid that talked in a weird mix of flute-like noises, glottal stops, and Yoda-style English (IIRC) (Key-op? That's what it sounded like, anyway). The main villain (Zoltan? Zoltar?) had a male (dubbed) voice, but was wearing lipstick, which confused the hell out of me as a kid. I think towards the end of the series the villain was unmasked. GI JOE: Remember kids, civilian life is full of traps set by The Enemy. Better to stay on base, where you know who your friends are. And does anyone else remember the episode where the base was going to be shut down? Pre-emptive lobbying by OUTLOOK? VOLTRON: Didn't watch it much, but it did kick off the craze for robots combining into larger robots, I suppose. Steven ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- Steven Kaye box_nine@ix.netcom.com Reason - rationality - is a concentration camp, where the sets of concepts for surviving in a chaotic universe form vast, though finite, rows of huts, separated into blocks by electric fences, which the searchlights of Attention rove over, picking out now one group of huts, now another. Thoughts, like prisoners - imprisoned for their own security and safety - scurry and march and labour in a flat two-dimensional zone, forbidden to leap fences, gunned down by laser beams of madness and unreason if they try to. Ian Watson, THE EMBEDDING From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Michael S Beck [msb216@is7.nyu.edu] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 12:20 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: More Thoughts on Cartoons GI JOE also had a few episodes with Mythos connotations. Obviously there was the movie, which had a great opening sequence, a forgettable plot, and some rather memorable monstrous bad guys who could easily be remenant Serpent Men. There was also one episode where Cobra calls up an ancient centipede that is finally trapped at the bottom of the ocean. The great thing about Cobra was that it was able to come up with original ways to defeat the Joes that hadn't already been cliched over and over. On Sun, 2 Apr 2000, Steven Kaye wrote: > Some cartoons that haven't come up, from my misspent youth: > > STAR BLAZERS - Earth gets hit with some sort of plague bombs, and our > heroes have to travel to a distant galaxy (on a converted Japanese > WWII battleship, the Yamato) to find a cure in time. Crew included > the inevitable beautiful alien princess, the robot who was in love > with said princess, a doctor who was always drinking glasses of > water, a crusty old captain, and others I don't recall off hand. > > This was apparently the butchered-for-US release version of SPACE > SHIP YAMATO - among the things changed to protect young innocents was > that the doctor was an alcoholic (hence the constant drinking). I > remember every episode ended with "Hurry Star Blazers! Earth has only > [fill in the blank] days left!" > > G-FORCE: No idea what the original Japanese series title was - this > involved a group of superheroes, fighting off nasty aliens from > Planet Spectra while wearing silly white bird-motif outfits. There > was the lovable slow-witted guy with a physique like a beer barrel, > the rash young team leader (Mark), this other guy that seemed to > stand around a lot and act moody (Jason), the Kate Moss-thin female, > and this kid that talked in a weird mix of flute-like noises, glottal > stops, and Yoda-style English (IIRC) (Key-op? That's what it sounded > like, anyway). The main villain (Zoltan? Zoltar?) had a male (dubbed) > voice, but was wearing lipstick, which confused the hell out of me as > a kid. I think towards the end of the series the villain was unmasked. > > GI JOE: Remember kids, civilian life is full of traps set by The > Enemy. Better to stay on base, where you know who your friends are. > And does anyone else remember the episode where the base was going to > be shut down? Pre-emptive lobbying by OUTLOOK? > > VOLTRON: Didn't watch it much, but it did kick off the craze for > robots combining into larger robots, I suppose. > > Steven > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > Steven Kaye > box_nine@ix.netcom.com > > Reason - rationality - is a concentration camp, where the sets of > concepts for surviving in a chaotic universe form vast, though > finite, rows of huts, separated into blocks by electric fences, which > the searchlights of Attention rove over, picking out now one group of > huts, now another. > > Thoughts, like prisoners - imprisoned for their own security and > safety - scurry and march and labour in a flat two-dimensional zone, > forbidden to leap fences, gunned down by laser beams of madness and > unreason if they try to. > > Ian Watson, THE EMBEDDING > From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Nerva Vels [nerva@escape.com] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 1:26 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: Re: More Thoughts on Cartoons Steven Kay writes: > G-FORCE: No idea what the original Japanese series title was - this > involved a group of superheroes, fighting off nasty aliens from > Planet Spectra while wearing silly white bird-motif outfits. There > was the lovable slow-witted guy with a physique like a beer barrel, > the rash young team leader (Mark), this other guy that seemed to > stand around a lot and act moody (Jason), the Kate Moss-thin female, > and this kid that talked in a weird mix of flute-like noises, glottal > stops, and Yoda-style English (IIRC) (Key-op? That's what it sounded > like, anyway). The main villain (Zoltan? Zoltar?) had a male (dubbed) > voice, but was wearing lipstick, which confused the hell out of me as > a kid. I think towards the end of the series the villain was unmasked. And I respond: The original name was Gatchaman ( I don't recall the spelling) and Zoltar was so androgynous that he/she turned out to be (to me) the highlight of all the episodes - in the US, everything was so sanitized that the only true wierdness was Zoltar and THAT was the focus (yes, I had a crush on Zoltar. So Sue Me). Of course, wierdness being bad, and US being as it may, I suspect a deep thread of conditioning of young minds here..... For a while, btw, Jason was a robot, and so was the little kid (who's name is Key-op, btw) -- I don't know if it was part of the story thread originally or the US machinations. Oh, and the girl, when I first saw it as a kid, was named Princess (So I named my daughter after her) and now, in it's recent incarnation on Cartoon Network I think, but I could be wrong, they all have new names (that SUCK, yo!!!) and her name is now Agnes -- wait till you find out their last names, I think it's something like Doright or Good something or other. I don't watch the americanized versions anymore, as you can tell. They make me gag. The japanese Gatchamen is MUCH more violent and gory and fun. Oh and you forgot the secret base with the other robots that tended to them and gave them their instructions, which reminds me of the Power Rangers base (and am I glad THAT craze is over). Trivia: My best friend has a few original japanese versions of Power Rangers, and they were a tad cooler, but the best one was the one dubbed to be xxx-rated. Nervy From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Davide Mana [doctor.dee@libero.it] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 1:43 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: More Thoughts on Cartoons Greetings. Steven Kaye could have spent his youth a lot worse than this.... >STAR BLAZERS [snip!] >This was apparently the butchered-for-US release version of SPACE >SHIP YAMATO They also changed a definite nationalistic bend of the series - I mean, it's the _Yamato_ they retrofit to save the planet. But it was good. >G-FORCE: No idea what the original Japanese series title was ROTFL! Gatchaman! Kagaku Ninjatai Gatchaman (Scientific Ninja Corps Gatchaman), to be absolutely precise. Courtesy of Tatsunoko, Japan's home of heroes. Class of 1972. The USA audience got it so heavily butchered it should have been a crime - the action was moved from a balkanized near-future Earth to a series of 'worlds of the Federation', all battles were said to involve robots and therefore did not cause human casualties and, worst than all, they spliced in some amateurish sequences with an absolutely ugly R2-D2 clone acting as a narrator/comedy relief/filler. Italian critics really hated this one, expecially as one of the good guys buys the farm at the end of the first series. Just like that. Dead. The fact that he did return in the second, courtesy of a pretty obvious plot device, did not placate them, either. A touch of intelectualoid posturing - the series portrays a classic team of archetipes: the fearless leader, the ruthless outsider, the sensitive woman, the eager kid and the funny fatman. It won't get more classic than this. >The main villain (Zoltan? Zoltar?) had a male (dubbed) >voice, but was wearing lipstick, which confused the hell out of me as >a kid. I think towards the end of the series the villain was unmasked. Confusing, but appropriate - in the first episode of each of the _three series_ the GOO-like evil mind from outer space picks a human kid and mutates him/her in order to create his new field-commander. The twist is, this alien critter has a penchant for turning little girls into male adults (like Zoltar) or young boys into punkish famme-fatales (like in the beginning of the second series). This is so damn twisted it'a a pity I never thought so far of using in a CoC game. File under -'Gifts bestowed by the Great Old Ones'. And before you ask - yes, I do remember much of this stuff without much effort. And I also have the support of a good anime/manga reference library. Cheers! Davide Mana Torino, Italy doctor.dee@libero.it The Ice Cave - http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine/leiber/50/ice_cave.htm From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of EdDrWho@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 2:24 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: It's a GOOD life. (spoilers) In a message dated 4/2/00 2:12:06 AM Central Daylight Time, LizardRoi@aol.com writes: > Before the > men who were afraid of menstruation and moon magick took over by fire and > sword and the concept of slavery. Don't knock it. There's good money in it. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Eckhard Huelshoff [EHuelshoff@t-online.de] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 2:23 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: Eh, did I miss something!? Good Evening. The 3 months are over and I am back from France [ Where I did not have any Internet access :-( ]. And therefore I am back on this list. Concerning Delta Green: I finally managed to buy a copy of DG:Countdown which I did find in Paris. Great Book, excellent work, magnificent, but...[ just a tiny but ;-) ] [ don't know whether this is still necessary, but: ] S P O I L E R A L E R T Just some minor corrections concerning German spelling and/or grammar and some additional information: 1. page 348: The title is BUNDESAMT FUER VERFASSUNGSSCHUTZ 2. page 349: The spelling is Grenzschutzgruppe 9 3. Concerning Grenzschutzgruppe 9 In the Book it is written that they assassinated an unarmed member of the RAF terrorist group. This is not really correct if we do speak about the same incident. During that incident in 1993 a GSG 9 team tried to arrest two RAF terrorists on a German railway station. One of the terrorists first killed one of the youg GSG 9 men and then commited suicide [ that's the official version ]. The other terrorist, a woman, got arrested. 4. Concerning the Bundesgrenzschutz There were many scandals concerning the BGS during the last few years: After the German reunification the BGS need more men and women to fulfill its duties. Therefore they hired people they wouldn't have hired just a few years before. The result was a rise in corruption and crime in the BGS. Just a two examples: * Two BGS men [ brothers by the way ] who were working on Frankfurt international Airport helped to smuggle drugs into the country * Quite a number of BGS officers are accused of violating immigration laws: The let people from Eastern Europe illegally cross the border into Germany after those poor people payed them thousands of Deutschmarks. 5. German names URNST UDEL!?!?!? Mon Dieu. ECKHARD From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of EdDrWho@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 2:26 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Cartoon lust In a message dated 4/2/00 3:46:51 AM Central Daylight Time, doctor.dee@libero.it writes: > And when the man with the gun meets the man with the rifle, the man with > the gun is a dead man. > Unless the man with a gun is Clint Eastwood, in which case a lot of rethinking should be done...fast. Hot tip: Aim for the face. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of EdDrWho@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 2:36 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: More Thoughts on Cartoons In a message dated 4/2/00 1:48:44 PM Central Daylight Time, doctor.dee@libero.it writes: > They also changed a definite nationalistic bend of the series - I mean, > it's the _Yamato_ they retrofit to save the planet. > But it was good. It's now a miniatures game, IIRC...Gotta love those 18" main guns. Launch a shell the size of your little brother twenty miles. ObDG: Maybe not all of those German dreadnoughts from WWI were scrapped or scuttled after all...maybe P-Division got a few. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Davide Mana [doctor.dee@libero.it] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 3:01 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Eh, did I miss something!? Greetings! He's back! >The 3 months are over and I am back from France [ Where I did not have any >Internet access :-( ]. > >And therefore I am back on this list. Greetings, Heckard, and welcome back. And just in time for the new round of elections in Italy! It's good to know we'll finally be able again to throw a little Eurocentric pov on this list. How was Paris? later.... Davide Mana Torino, Italy doctor.dee@libero.it The Ice Cave - http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine/leiber/50/ice_cave.htm From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Davide Mana [doctor.dee@libero.it] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 3:48 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: Interesting resource Greetings. It's surfing night, and here's something that might be useful - or fuel some discussion. http://www.philm.demon.co.uk/Miscellaneous/ConspiracyTexts.htm It's a 'make your own conspiracy paper' article originally from Shadis. Interesting. The whole site's interesting to roleplayers, BTW Davide Mana From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Eckhard Huelshoff [EHuelshoff@t-online.de] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 3:47 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Eh, did I miss something!? Davide Mana schrieb: [snip] > > Greetings, Heckard, and welcome back. > And just in time for the new round of elections in Italy! New Elections in Italy? This raises two interesting questions: Do the Neo-Fascists have any chance to get into government? Does the European union repeat what they did with the Austrians? > It's good to know we'll finally be able again to throw a little Eurocentric > pov on this list. Yep, let's fight the Yankee domination ;-) > > How was Paris? Inspiring. For example: I lived in a house near Place de la Bastille and that house was built upon the old underground cells of the Bastille in fact using those old structures. And as you might remember: A while ago I thought about writing a campaign using the German "revolution" of 1989 as a background. Well... it is nearly complete. And -of course- one of the campaign's chapters takes place in Paris during the 200th anniversary of the beginning of the French revolution. If anybody should be interested in a brief outline of that campaign I might post it here. Just ask. BTW: Who of you guys came up with the idea of calling that campaign "Paperclip 89"? ECKHARD From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Popeyesays@aol.com Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 4:06 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: More Thoughts on Cartoons In a message dated 4/2/00 2:39:36 PM Central Daylight Time, EdDrWho@aol.com writes: << It's now a miniatures game, IIRC...Gotta love those 18" main guns. Launch a shell the size of your little brother twenty miles. >> What always amazed me s that the Yamato was sunk, she was bombed and torpedoed towreckage and SANK, where is the refit potential in the shattered wreckage at the bottom of the ocean floor - her sister-ship Musashi was sunk even earlier. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Joab Ben Stieglitz [stieg@ix.netcom.com] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 4:15 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: RE: DG: Cartoon lust Along these lines, I firmly recommend a book called Saturday Morning Feever, which discusses the history of this American cultural phenomenon, and points such noteworthy realities as the drug connection behind Scooby-Doo, the success of Josie and the Pussycats due to the character of Alexandra the bitch, and the truth behind Race Bannon and Dr. Quest. Joab Ben Stieglitz stieg@ix.netcom.com http://stieg.home.netcom.com/ From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of john ogden [goidel@hotmail.com] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 4:36 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Cartoon lust Pardon my blatant provincialism, but what the @$%^&* is "naff"? John Ogden, stuck in the States >From: "Andy Robertson" >Reply-To: dgrpg@delta-green.com >To: >Subject: Re: DG: Cartoon lust >Date: Sat, 1 Apr 2000 11:02:42 +0100 > >Duh. Flintstones. Johnny Quest. Deputy Dawg. Scooby-do. Whacky races. >UK 1966-76ish. > >Not much "classic" animation and not much really good stuff. And AFAIK >cartoons are considered naff by todays UK young. > >Anticipating DG bits > >The Glove Cleaner. > >----- Original Message ----- >From: > > b) what non-anime (which, face it, is a thread unto itself) cartoons >were >a > > part of growing up elsewhere > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Andy Robertson [andywrobertson@clara.co.uk] Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 4:40 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: Re: Really Big Ships ----- Original Message ----- From: > << > It's now a miniatures game, IIRC...Gotta love those 18" main guns. Launch a > shell the size of your little brother twenty miles. > >> I love Battleships. Beautiful, beautiful, vast, machines. Have you noticed the things we make only ever get really beautiful after two or three generations of refinement as a killing machine? Does anyone on the list have links or info appertaining to the _really_ big ships that Nazis were once planning to build? 80,000 tonners that would have made the Bismark look like a heavy cruiser. 8 x 20" guns, IIRC. Or is it just a rumor? Here's a good Bismark site FYI. WWII campaign? http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/4273/ The Glove Cleaner From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of FAC [feraznar@teleline.es] Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2000 2:09 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: RE: DG: Al-Andalus Well, here in Spain we have a rpg designed that happens in our middle age, that game have lots of info related to the moslem presence in Spain, the name is Aquelarre, that means meeting of witches, is a very good game if somebody is interested I will try to translate some info. I know also that the author is a Cthulhu fan, maybe he could write something about this. Fernando Aznar