From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Dave Farnell [superdave@disinfo.net] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 5:32 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: Shiny-san s p o i l e r s p a c e Mr. Shiny is indeed in At Your Door. He is a small, smart shoggoth, not a proto-shoggoth-matter being. In addition to other sitings, he is also the perrenial running mate for Big C's presidential campaign, and also the "press guy," seeing as Mr. Cthulhu is always sleeping when reporters want to talk to him. Mr. Shiny is definitely one of the coolest characters to come out of Chaosium, and I'm not surprised he's making unscheduled guest appearances in San Francisco, but he doesn't appear in the official version of The Stars Are Right, unfortunately. Dave From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Michael Layne [theherald@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 5:41 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Battleship deckplans On 20 April 2000 AD, The Man in Black said, >On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Michael Layne wrote: > > > > I was wondering if anyone could steer me towards some > > >battleship or cruiser deckplans that I want to use for an upcoming >game. > > >Preferably of a US warship thats in service. (Strangely though the US >navy Actually, I didn't write that -- I was quoting the person who I answered...:) > >Now that I think about it, I might go down to Pearl Harbor and see if I >can score some Arizona or Missouri plans. Then again, I might not. What's >in it for me? :) > Why, the same thing that all in DG receive as a reward for the incredible risks they take, to hold off the darkness from Humanity, if only for their lifetimes -- the satisfaction of a job well done! (If we were in this for the money, we'd be working for S.P.E.C.T.R.E.!):) My suggestion (if you can get only one set) would be the "Missouri" plans, for modern-day DG reference purposes. The "Arizona" had but one sister ship, the "Pennsylvania" (also at Pearl Harbor on December 7, but high and dry in drydock -- which didn't keep her from shooting down some Japanese aircraft -- but sunk, IIRC, by the BAKER detonation at Operation CROSSROADS, Bikini Atoll, postwar). While "Arizona" (and "Pennsylvania") might be potentially useful for 1930s - 1940s scenarios involving Division P, etc., there is a (small) possibility one of "Missouri"'s sister ships may return to sea one day. Two (possibly three) of the "Iowa" class are memorials, or are apparently scheduled to become such. But we can't rule out possible recommissioning of the last of the class, "Wisconsin" (budgets permitting) someday at the urging of the Marines, who don't really consider the 5-inch gun on modern DDs and CGs to be sufficient fire-support... (Don't laugh too hard -- remember how many times the "Iowa" class vessels have been in and out of mothballs before!) A battleship in a "Mary Celeste" type of scenario might be a bit too big for the Agents to go poking around aboard... Also, a BB is a major fleet unit that wouldn't generally go cruising about unaccompanied any more than would a CVN! (Although such problems can be gotten around if really necessary, to involve even the flagship of a battle group in paranormal consequences -- an example would be the "Nimitz" in the film "The Final Countdown" -- the CVN had to remain on course (and thus get caught in the "Time Storm") due to the need to recover a damaged A7 aircraft; the escorts were directed to alter course and avoid the storm, which thus grabbed only the "Nimitz"...) Ideally, the setting you want for such a scenario is going to be a warship that can steam independently, so you won't have to worry about making such arrangements. The biggest warship that normally does that sort of thing is a cruiser. (Unfortunately, modern cruisers are not easy to find interior plans for...) A destroyer would probably do as well (the "Ticonderoga" CGs are effectively uprated "Spruance" DDs), or even a frigate (such as a "Perry"). "Floating Drydock" sells some interior plans for "Gearing" DDs, but your scenario would then have to involve a foreign naval vessel, as no ships of this class are currently in US service. As I mentioned in a previous post, "Floating Drydock" has plans (apparently including interior deck plans) for a "Bear" class Coast Guard cutter. (I should have noted these are for the ship as of April 1986 (though she is unlikely to have changed much), are 1/96 scale, and are $20.00 + shipping.) For info on the ship whose deck plans I'm advertising, check the Coast Guard Atlantic Region Cutters page (http://www.uscg.mil/lantarea/cutter). Almost all the "WMEC" links active on that page are to the web pages of "Bear" class cutters. (There's also a link to the "Eagle" homepage, for you fans of S.M. Stirling's "Island in the Sea of Time" series...):) Some of these web pages show interior and exterior views (though not plans). Also, there is a medium-sized jpg of the "Mohawk" of this class at http://www.bluejacket.com/uscgc_mohawk_wmec913.jpg (I found this one awhile back while looking for sites concerning the WWII cutter "Mohawk", which I visited a number of years ago in Wilmington, Delaware.) Another site (http://www.calcote.com/mohawk/ship.htm) has numerous pictures of the present-day "Mohawk" (including a 360 degree rotation of a computer simulation of her). And, while looking over Coast Guard sites, I discovered that at least one modern Coast Guard ship has deck plans on its website. The USCGC "Healy" (http://www.uscg.mil/pacarea/healy/) is the service's newest icebreaker, however! IMHO she would probably be better for the "DG Agents and Friendlies Investigate Secret Antarctic Karotechia Base Under Cover of Polar Exploration" scenario (perhaps linked to an early 21st century version of "Beyond the Mountains of Madness", with the cutter's two HH-65 helicopters substituting for the Boeing 247s of the original 30s version):), rather than a "What Happened to The Crew? Guys, This Isn't Funny!" scenario! Sorry to be so wordy! Michael Layne DGGF#688 theherald@hotmail.com (Didn't one of the DG related websites have character data for a USCG Captain and some other Coast Guard specialties?) ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Florian R. Hanke [hankef@student.ethz.ch] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 6:00 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Shiny-san Dave Farnell wrote: > s > p > o > i > l > e > r > s > p > a > c > e > Mr. Shiny is indeed in At Your Door. My Creature Companion also tells me that Albert Shiny is also in Michael Shea's "Fat Face". Regards, Florian Hanke From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 6:07 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Re: Big fires In a message dated 00-04-20 15:44:30 EDT, you write: << >Combining nitrogen and oxygen to get nitrous oxide is an exenthalpic >reaction. That means the whole atmosphere could in theory get set alight, >and "burn" into a combination of nitrogen and nitrous oxides. This was a >minor but real concern when the first nuke was set off. Fortunately the >energy disperses too quickly to keep the temperature high enough for the >reaction to continue. Didn't one of the physicists at the TRINITY test in 1945 make a bet that this would happen? >> Y'know, even if we can't keep a chain reaction sustained, I think raising the nitrous oxide content of our atmosphere is a good thing, and worthy of research. Then we won't care about any steenkeeng ozone layer. Mark McFadden From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Michael Layne [theherald@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 6:24 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Battleship deckplans On 20 April 2000 AD, Stephen Joseph Ellis says, in relation to Battleship Plans acquired by the MiB: > > P.S. Scanning them and posting them on the Web should be a >laugh (And attract all sorts of ECHELON and NSA attention.) Not that it would make a significant difference in the case of the MiB, which probably has his own dossier (or his own filing cabinet) at "Never Say Anything"... B.Y.O.B. would mean in this case, "Build Your Own Battleship"? Remember that you'll have to be able to get it out of the basement once you finish building it!:) Michael Layne DGGF#688 theherald@hotmail.com "A whole filing cabinet full of files on the MiB's activities? I thought I told you to put that stuff on microfiche!" "This _is_ microfiche." ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 6:34 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Battleship deckplans In a message dated 00-04-20 18:47:05 EDT, you write: << Although such problems can be gotten around if really necessary, to involve even the flagship of a battle group in paranormal consequences -- an example would be the "Nimitz" in the film "The Final Countdown" -- the CVN had to remain on course (and thus get caught in the "Time Storm") due to the need to recover a damaged A7 aircraft; the escorts were directed to alter course and avoid the storm, which thus grabbed only the "Nimitz".. >> The sequence in the Bridge goes like so (according to a buddy who was doing phone talker duty): Landing Signal Officer on deck (actually the talker repeating what he says): "Bird in the groove." Talker on Bridge: [to LSO]"Bird in the groove, aye." [to Duty Officer] "Bird in the groove, sir." Duty Officer ("the Conn"): [to Bridge Talker] "Bird in the groove, very well." [to Helmsman] "Helmsman, steady as she goes." Helmsman: "Steady as she goes on heading [yadada yadada], aye." Ship maintains heading directly into wind, as it does during Flight Ops. A little time passes. Arresting Gear Officer (actually the talker repeating what he says): "Bird on deck." Talker on Bridge: [to AGO]"Bird on deck, aye." [to Duty Officer] "Bird on deck, sir." Duty Officer ("the Conn"): [to Bridge Talker] "Bird on deck, very well." [to Helmsman] "[ whatever. Return to heading yadayada or go that way ]" Helmsman: "[ yeah, like he said.] Aye aye, sir." Mark McFadden Wanna see the preflight check for an RF-8G Hula? It is an exotic interactive dance with a story told by the hands and through body language for the entertainment of pilot and ground support crew. The dancers wear the traditional Flight Deck garb of Turd Shirt, life vest and 3 or 4 tiedown chains. Tipping is not required but always appreciated. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Purple Kat [kringskeep@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 6:36 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: The noble skill of Lying Of course the subject IS 'The Noble Skill of Lying' so of course The Man in Black is lying! If I were to infer from his statement I would believe that he is more sexually active than a lemur in heat! Of course I have no knowledge of lemurs, or heat, or sex, or activity. And I will deny any charges to the opposite. Of course if such statement is true I will also deny any knowledge of such statement just to deny lying. Purple Kat Who had 5 people believing for over a week that she had multiple personalities. Even now they are still confused. >Might I advocate a lifestyle choice of abstinence and celibacy for you >both, after all, it's celibacy that makes Daniel Harms the great author >that he is today. Condoms might be fine for some stupid people, but those >things *rip* and *tear* people! Abstinence is the only sure thing! Avoid >sexually transmitted diseases, it ruined Daniel Harms, it''ll ruin you! > >The Man in Black is : your Olympic Hero. >Novus Ordo Seclorum : Annuit Coeptus : E Pluribus Unum >"Don't make me take off my sunglasses!" - Griss, Bringing Out the Dead >http://www.carnwyffa.u-net.com [EMERALD HAMMER] > ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Til Eulenspiegel [duggerj@mindspring.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 7:50 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Re: New DS pictures/DNA/Panspermia -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Thursday, 20 April 2000 > Well, I've looked very carefully at those Mars pictures to generate > appropriate backgrounds. Doing a matte job could be easy, but > there are some big limitations. You have to make sure the lighting > matches, and it's very difficult to have the subject be IN the > background, rather than simply in the foreground. Agent Timmins, you want to get Digital Elevation Maps of Mars. I remember various utilities exist for converting these into heightfields, which can then be rendered as 3D objects by various ray-tracers. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 6.5.2 for non-commercial use iQA/AwUBOP+lxoJ4fAzAb7AFEQLuMACg+04iDEzQRnaWscZvvjrnLXg7NWcAoP5U TTar341+YSpY1fjK5LgSZk++ =clXf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of William Timmins [wtimmins@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 7:15 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Shiny-san All this talk of shoggoths reminds me of a very amusing scene in a campaign I ran. I basically postulated a bunch of more intelligent shoggoths in Antarctica. Nothing is more dangerous than a smart, cautious Mythos critter, and they are perfect if you have let things get too powerful (too much magic, or firepower, or whatever) So, one shoggoth carved a trap, slowly and quietly, underneath the camp the PCs had set up. Basically, the ice beneath was carved out so that, with counterweight, a big slab of ice would fall and flip over, smashing a bunch of tents. Chortle! And then there was the ice tunnel, with drop-away floor panels. One missed Luck roll, one less PC. And then it turned out the shoggoths had learned to whistle. Whistle REAL loud. That is, a sonic ranged attack (most Mythos critters lack ranged attacks, which can screw them) Party, with elder race allies, huddled behind an elder sign, confidant that they had protection as they fired on the shoggoths. WHISTLE... **BAM!**, the Elder sign shattered. Uh oh. -=Will ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Michael Layne [theherald@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 7:24 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Battleship deckplans On 20 April, 2000 AD, "Michael Layne" said some things that probably required further proofreading: > For info on the ship whose deck plans I'm advertising, check the Coast >Guard Atlantic Region Cutters page (http://www.uscg.mil/lantarea/cutter). That should be: http://www.uscg.mil/lantarea/Cutters/cutters.html >Almost all the "WMEC" links active on that page are to the web pages of >"Bear" class cutters. All the WMECs there with 900-series numbers are "Bear" class (AKA "Famous" class, as they are all named for famous Coast Guard Cutters of the past...) > (There's also a link to the "Eagle" homepage, for you >fans of S.M. Stirling's "Island in the Sea of Time" series...):) Which would itself make an interesting DG scenario -- provided you didn't mind a permanent change in the time of the campaign (to about 3000 years ago)... (Wonder if there were any DG Agents or Friendlies on Nantucket for the Event? Just what _was_ the Event?) > Another site >(http://www.calcote.com/mohawk/ship.htm) has numerous pictures of the >present-day "Mohawk" (including a 360 degree rotation of a computer >simulation of her). Forgot to note that these animations will require Quicktime. But the still photos can be viewed without QT... Michael Layne DGGF#688 theherald@hotmail.com ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Michael Layne [theherald@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 7:40 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Shiny-san On 20 April 2000 AD, "William Timmins" pointed out a requirement for Mythos protective equipment upgrades due to newly determined Threat capability: >And then it turned out the shoggoths had learned to whistle. Whistle REAL >loud. That is, a sonic ranged attack (most Mythos critters lack ranged >attacks, which can screw them) > >Party, with elder race allies, huddled behind an elder sign, confidant that >they had protection as they fired on the shoggoths. WHISTLE... **BAM!**, >the >Elder sign shattered. >Uh oh. Yes, such incidents could prove a positive embarrassment to personnel faced with Whistling Shoggoths! To reduce the risk of such attacks, Mythos Trooper Supplies has introduced an Elder Sign etched on sturdy, transparent Lexan plastic, guaranteed not to crack or shatter (even under the influence of Shoggoth whistles) under normal conditions! If your Lexan Elder Sign is shattered by a whistling Shoggoth, any surviving member of your team can return it to the company for immediate replacement! For polar operations, even Lexan Elder Signs may be subject to embrittlement due to the extremely low temperatures. Thus, a self-heated version, with embedded microfilaments and a rechargeable insulated battery, has been produced for use in such environments. (Service tests by DG personnel and MTS product testers, during the upcoming Antarctic deployment of USCGC "Healy", are currently planned...) Caution: The breakage guarantee on the Lexan Elder Sign is void if the Lexan Elder Sign is fired from a Railgun at speeds of over 5 km/sec. Michael Layne DGGF#688 theherald@hotmail.com ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of William Timmins [wtimmins@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 7:41 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: I got it! (Countdown) Finally! I'm tearing through this delightful tome of sanity quaking horror. Hee! Among things that have already likely been discussed, I really like the opportunities within the book to run very different sorts of games. Frex, running a game based on one of the other groups (Phenomen-X, PISCES, etc). This allows you to change modern day CoC in many different ways, and drop elements in as desired, such as a more traditional, less conspiracy oriented Investigation campaign, or an end of the world holocaust campaign. I also enjoyed the Hastur info greatly. Now considering integrating material. Strazh Pryectn shouldn't be too hard to integrate with SV-8. The handling of psychic gifts isn't too different than how I've laid it out, but I should address issues of compatibility. I think I also need to make more of my thoughts on Hastur and Xanth a bit more explicit. Hmm. In any case, Pagan team, Countdown has been well worth the wait! Thank you! If anyone has particular suggestions or opinions on integration issues, I'd appreciate the feedback. Privately would likely be best. ObDG: Hastur or other reality-bend trick: Have Cultists warn about the dangerous Lacunae, ripples in existance caused by the disturbance or motion between one reality and another. Or perhaps by destructions or creations of things. Give lots of conflicting stories, but basically they are something bad, and the agents' actions are likely to arouse their 'attention'. Plant hints. Things gone missing. Maybe missing informants. Informants that are, at times, not remembered by any save the agents. Play with causality. Then send the Lacunae after them. A psychic agent or an informant can create a proper sense of panic, perhaps with a storm and some material manifestation. Material manifestations could be people or beings who are particularly taken by another reality, or caught between. Ghosts and phantom voices warning the players to run... or to embrace their fate. Random noises and events inspiring dread... try to get them going. Then, as soon as it crests or get old, the stimulus vanishes. Nothing happens, the premonitions stop. Then have NPCs start asking the agents where the agents' compatriot is. Leave plenty of evidence, create an entire life of one (or more) PCs that had been working with the agents... at least, as far as everyone but the agents remembers. If you do it right, you could plant seeds of this very far back. Start many sessions before. Make up the missing PC and come up with ways in which the PC would have obviously assisted in investigations. If you skip over details while they happen, most players won't notice. But jot them down. When the PCs later investigate this 'missing' agent (or friendly), the challenge is to show past events as being MORE plausible, with the missing character. Worse yet, the PCs' bosses will not be happy to receive no reason for the character's disappearance. Over time... everyone forgets the character. All better. Nobody will remember questioning the PCs. All evidence of the character's existance will be misplaced or subtly different. But, of course, the PCs will remember everyone else's comments. This should be worth multiple 0/D8 SAN checks, over the course of the subplot. Again, preparation is key, and this should only be done once. But properly done, the hint of the Lacunae should assist in conveying the fragile nature of human reality. For a properly Hasturian spin, the Lacunae should be talked about, by those heavily influenced, as unassuming people that are never quite remembered. Painted as backlit figures, with no distinguishable features, almost appearing as holes in the canvas. -=Will ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Til Eulenspiegel [duggerj@mindspring.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 8:17 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: New DS pictures -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Thursday, 20 April 2000 [snip] > > DG contacts, heretofore referred to as Shambler Handler 1 (SH 1) > and 2, have asked Michael about the particulars of the explosion. > From transcript MKL-SH0-2000-01-11 (dashes represent redactions): > > SH1 "So, (SH0), that was a pretty f-g impressive blast! How the f- > did you do that?? I mean... you had, what, ---- plutonium? No f-g > way that could have worked. Well?" > SH2 "Is he going to answer? He just keeps staring at the monitor." > SH1 "Hey bud, Earth to (SH0)! C'mon, we got people to shoot, > monsters to stomp." > SH2 "Hey, shuttup, (SH1), might hurt his feelings!" > > SH0 "Enjoy story Thermopylae. Amusement. Blast is contortions of > geometric spacetime via concordance." > SH1 "Great. Just great. What?" > SH2 "(SH0), what do you mean by the blast? What was it? Did you ... > um, intensify the plutonium, or something?" > SH0 "Blast was not violence of form, not geometric conversion. > Blast was harmonious geometries brought in concordance with higher > harmonics, increase of form to bring decrease of forms." > SH2 "Great. That's ... great. So, it wasn't a regular nuclear > blast?" SH0 "No, (SH2). No great armies of river-drying energies. > Just proper placement of a few." > SH1 "This is some hyper-spatial transformation, using plutonium, > and creating a big explosion?" > SH0 "Unpoetic. Yes." > I know how the DS did this...more this weekend after I do proper research. For those curious, pull out your Dragon Magazine archive CD-ROM and do a keyword search on "Excalibur." -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPfreeware 6.5.2 for non-commercial use iQA/AwUBOP+sIIJ4fAzAb7AFEQLPmwCdH5/redgbUvunkv4apndCTSDnenoAoMdH vvz+aakNwFGDKZYHuNhlm9OL =hAqP -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of EdDrWho@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 7:54 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: RoE SPOILERS In a message dated 4/20/00 9:30:39 AM Central Daylight Time, superdave@disinfo.net writes: > Very bad. Well, I guess that answers the question of how to make the K > tougher. "It's so odd...I never knew my contact had a German accent in person...and so *Aryan* too..." From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of EdDrWho@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 7:55 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: Origins (was Re: DG: Unconvention) In a message dated 4/20/00 9:38:32 AM Central Daylight Time, wtimmins@hotmail.com writes: > Along those lines, anyone here planning to be at Origins? I am... Uh, I'll be at DucKon... From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of EdDrWho@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 8:42 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: The noble skill of Contraception In a message dated 4/20/2000 12:33:51 PM Central Daylight Time, j_holloway26@hotmail.com writes: > Yes, Albert Shiny first appears - IIRC - in "At Your Door." He is something > similar to Freygan, although possibly a more advanced model. He's also a > card in Mythos, and he may turn up in other places. Mr. Shiny might also > just be an exceptionally intelligent normal shoggoth. I can't really > remember. He's in The Book of Mosters, or whatever Chaosium is calling it now. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 8:49 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: The noble skill of Lying In a message dated 4/20/00 4:38:43 PM Pacific Daylight Time, kringskeep@hotmail.com writes: << Of course I have no knowledge of lemurs, or heat, or sex, or activity. And I will deny any charges to the opposite. >> Thank you, thank you. I also do weddings and bar mitzvahs. Joey the Lemur care of MST3K From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 9:00 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: I got it! (Countdown) In a message dated 4/20/00 5:43:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time, wtimmins@hotmail.com writes: << Then send the Lacunae after them. >> This sounds very much like a Changewind. Just to get everything back to Leiber. <> Or as active players known as Doublegangers. Mark McFadden From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Jason R. Armstrong [gerwalkveritech@juno.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 8:48 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Misperceptions On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:20:59 EDT LizardRoi@aol.com writes: > Good thing the press was covering *all the violence* at the IMF >protests, >huh? > >Mark McFadden > Just loves the way the world reorganizes itself *as if* the >cigar-chompers >and CSMs are planning this all from a Star Chamber. Thasssriiiiiight. The IMF Conference, and our "efforts to shut it down". Not like anybody needs to be told HERE, but- Even if they hadn't met, business would still transact. Nobody except for a small percentage (known as "high school kids" and/or "idiots") was there to literally shut down the meeting, which just as easily could have been over the phone. If the IMf, World Bank, or WTO were "destroyed" or "abolished" we would be ridding ourselves of an infrastructure, that, with _proper_ and _ethical_ governance, could do a helluva lotta good. Nobody except for the above were there with notions of litrerally "abolishing" anything. The fact that we did not "stop" the conference from occurring has been trumpeted in the various media as a "failure" for the protestors. I won't even dignify this absurd fallacy with my usual string of curse words, let alone a refutation. Christ, even NPR tried their best to make it look like some genXer festival of douchebags out to start anarchy kindergarten. At least in the report I heard on Monday. obDG: I am reminded once again why "things are not as they seem" is the most apt term to use regarding the press. Most of the coverage was not even deliberately malicious. It was just proceeeding from a variety of false premises. Now, the impressions have been laid. Soon, they will become what is described as "evidence", which will lead to assumed "correct" conclusions. In short, Carcosa isn't the only place where Truth is a Phantom. Mr. Tynes was spot on with that. Hate mail, or questions about the above I will gladly bug out about for hours on end, but off-list'll have to do. To conclude, though, let me say that a good visceral shock like this occasionally reminds me, that paranoid fantasies of deception and media mind-control are often rooted in entirely plausible truths. "I wanted a language of my own, My lips sucked empty And I mouthed the lines, Of this crowd That surrounds me, Punctured and parceled- I fold my hand..." Fugazi, "Burning" xJAYx ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of MurfNMurf@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 9:12 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Battleship deckplans In a message dated 4/20/00 5:47:05 PM Central Daylight Time, theherald@hotmail.com writes: << If we were in this for the money, we'd be working for S.P.E.C.T.R.E >> Sure, I've heard this name before, but what does it stand for? For that matter, what does the Bad Guy's S.P.I.D.E.R. (I believe) in T.H.U.N.D.E.R Agents comics stand for? -Ken- From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Jason R. Armstrong [gerwalkveritech@juno.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 9:32 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Making Karotechia more powerful I'm sending this right after having thought about my "Misperceptions" post. I started thinking about the possible replies, if any. Like, the jerkwater from somewhere in America who'll post, "Ethical governance? No such thing, dude." And then proceed to tell me, with Powerpoint slides, why it is that every governing body out there is either A) a viscious, underhanded collection of mobsters out to fuck over everyone, as part and parcel of BEING a governing body, or B)utterly ineffectual, and rightly condemned and hated for being so. 'Cause, hey, at least you know where the crooks are coming from, and hey, at least they'll get SOMETHING done, right? All this commentary, essentially to say that, because America has bankrolled various policies of profit for the few, at the expense of a vast majority of the rest of the world, SINCE IT'S INCEPTION, cruelty is "tradition" and must be "the way things are". Despite assumptions of it being soundly against our (intended) principles, and indeed, the same kind of ugly, cynical tyranny we sought to establish a Union to _escape_ from. Hey, says nameless jerkwater, forget all the lipservice to Liberty and that shit. Look around, dude, the Real America is What's In It For Me. My assumed reply is, of course, "If you think so little of your country, why the fuck are you here, you goddamed lily-livered, do-nothing traitor", or whatever. As ugly and cynical as his (or her) comments are, the hypothethical jerkwater only succeds in bringing out equally nonsensical stuff of the opposite vein from me. Now, onto the Real Point (tm). They say the worst kind of cynic, perhaps the only true kind, is the one who _became_ a hardened cynic, through the embitterment of being a Failed Idealist. A person whose ideals were so soundly, relentlessly, and (in their eyes) irrevocably quashed, they now believe in not just the foolishness of their ideals, but the innate foolishness of ANY ideal. The Hardened Cynic, in other words, is a Poisoned Idealist. They say the most easily led kind of fifth-columnist, is not the mole who fervently believes in what "The Other Side" thinks, but the cynic who uses any ideology, be it progressive or reactionary, on the basis of what it will profit them in the short term. Often, the profit is not wholly monetary, but may in fact involve pseudo-subversive goals of revenge against the society in which the fifth-columnist lives. A society, for one reason or another, they cannot find connection with, and thus hold no value for. Hence, the perfect mole is the Hardened Cynic, who seeks to destroy the society because its' ideals (and therefore, it ) failed them, and thus are to be despised. How to make the Karotechia more powerful? Almost everyone in America, 2000, is a potential Karotechia recruit. Maybe even everyone. Just waiting for the right time, place, and event. Everyone. :) xJAYx ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Philip A Posehn [paposehn@juno.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 9:38 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: Still more DG soundtrack You raise up your head And you ask, "Is this where it is?" And somebody points to you And says, "It's his." And you say, "What's mine?" And somebody else says, "Where what is?" And you say,"Oh my God am I here all alone?" And you know something's happening But you don't know what it is Do you Mr. Jones? "Ballad of a Thin Man" Bob Dylan ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of LizardRoi@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 9:53 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: DG: S.P.I.D.E.R. In a message dated 4/20/00 7:15:47 PM Pacific Daylight Time, MurfNMurf@aol.com writes: << For that matter, what does the Bad Guy's S.P.I.D.E.R. (I believe) in T.H.U.N.D.E.R Agents comics stand for? -Ken- >> I'll let someone with the James Bond books close at hand answer the S.P.E.C.T.R.E. question, although IIRC it stands for SPecial Executive Committee for Terrorism, Revenge and Extortion. According to Harlan Ellison, in his story 'Santa Claus vs. S.P.I.D.E.R. (collected in 'The Beast That Shouted Love At The Heart Of The World' , ISBN 0-451-08590-6), S.P.I.D.E.R. stands for: Society for Pollution, Infection and Destruction of Earthmen's Resources or Special Politburo Intent on Destroying Everybody's Race or Scabrous Predatory Invaders Determined to Eliminate Rationality or Secret Preyers Involved in Demolishing Everything Right-minded S P O I L E R Later Kris learns that S.P.I.D.E.R. doesn't stand for anything except what the little brain stealers look like. The one inhabiting the Bond Girl at the end revealed this when she tried to kill him. "... he was locked there in eternal darkness, on the bed, holding her body as it struggled to free itself, and he was forced by his nakedness to kill her using the one weapon God had given him when he came into the world. It was a special weapon, and it took almost a week to kill her." Amateurs. Mark McFadden who doesn't generally think of it as a weapon From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Philip A Posehn [paposehn@juno.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 9:51 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Misperceptions Of general interest both politically and as good DG scenario backdrop will be the plans for really big demonstrations at the 2 party national conventions. Anybody remember 1968? The most interesting part of the TV coverage of Chicago was the network that had BOTH William F. Buckley and Gore Vidal doing color commentary. Phil Posehn On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:48:02 -0400 "Jason R. Armstrong" writes: > > > > Just loves the way the world reorganizes itself *as if* the > >cigar-chompers > >and CSMs are planning this all from a Star Chamber. > Thasssriiiiiight. The IMF Conference, and our "efforts to > shut it > down". > Not like anybody needs to be told HERE, but- ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of EdDrWho@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 9:59 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Misperceptions In a message dated 4/20/00 9:56:51 PM Central Daylight Time, paposehn@juno.com writes: > The most interesting part of the TV coverage of Chicago was the network > that had BOTH William F. Buckley and Gore Vidal doing color commentary. Didn't Buckley call Vidal a "Queen" on live television? From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Philip A Posehn [paposehn@juno.com] Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 10:31 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: Misperceptions I believe so. There were suits and countersuits talked about for a while. Phil On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:59:03 EDT EdDrWho@aol.com writes: > In a message dated 4/20/00 9:56:51 PM Central Daylight Time, > paposehn@juno.com writes: > > > The most interesting part of the TV coverage of Chicago was the > network > > that had BOTH William F. Buckley and Gore Vidal doing color > commentary. > > Didn't Buckley call Vidal a "Queen" on live television? > ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. From: owner-dgrpg@delta-green.com on behalf of Popeyesays@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 11:06 PM To: dgrpg@delta-green.com Subject: Re: DG: S.P.I.D.E.R. Amongst your evil organization acronyms you have forgotten T.H.R.U.S.H. from The Man from U.N.C.L.E. - and - for those of us who read the Man from UNCLE books - the truly sinister D.A.G.G.E.R.