From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of talaphid [isa@zerg.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 12:10 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: [DG] Mission assignment > > Besides, the idea of a charcter like ANDREA is just a hackneyed piece of bad > > spy fiction. I've been led to expect better from the DGML. > Y'know, if the list isn't living up to your exacting standards, I've got the > perfect solution for you: > Sign off. Please limit such love to person-to-person email (as opposed to person-to-list) email and Nights at the Opera. Such vital information as a big piece of anticromulance resonance in a Cell is as like as not to end up ruining an operation in the sort of way -any- of the theories of ANDREA would -not- be necessary to clean up afterwards. _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of talaphid [isa@zerg.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 12:10 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: [DG] Mission assignment > > Besides, the idea of a charcter like ANDREA is just a hackneyed piece of bad > > spy fiction. I've been led to expect better from the DGML. > Y'know, if the list isn't living up to your exacting standards, I've got the > perfect solution for you: > Sign off. Please limit such love to person-to-person email (as opposed to person-to-list) email and Nights at the Opera. Such vital information as a big piece of anticromulance resonance in a Cell is as like as not to end up ruining an operation in the sort of way -any- of the theories of ANDREA would -not- be necessary to clean up afterwards. _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Khorne [khorne@cyberlink.bc.ca] Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 6:52 PM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: Re: [DG] Why Hasn't Alphonse Gone Insane? >For DG to work at all, someone has to know everyone that's involved. It's >asset management: Something Bad (tm) happens in Sacramento. Where is the >closest cell? How do I contact them? If the primary contact is off >gibbering and clinging to furry objects (don't ask) how do I contact the >rest of the cell? So all MJ-12 has to do is find this person and run him througn OUTLOOK a couple of times and POW no more Delta Green. I'm surprised they've lasted this long. _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Khorne [khorne@cyberlink.bc.ca] Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 6:47 PM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] ANDREA / My 2 cents "Thus the first ANDREA my players were confronted with was a 50year old man of Italian heritage whose real name was Carmine Sapia, a former mafia leader turned into DG-cleaner [ sorry, Davide for that cliché overkill ;-) ]" Now this is very interesting. I'm always interested in new ways to use la Cosa Nostra. _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Khorne [khorne@cyberlink.bc.ca] Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 6:52 PM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: Re: [DG] Why Hasn't Alphonse Gone Insane? >For DG to work at all, someone has to know everyone that's involved. It's >asset management: Something Bad (tm) happens in Sacramento. Where is the >closest cell? How do I contact them? If the primary contact is off >gibbering and clinging to furry objects (don't ask) how do I contact the >rest of the cell? So all MJ-12 has to do is find this person and run him througn OUTLOOK a couple of times and POW no more Delta Green. I'm surprised they've lasted this long. _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Khorne [khorne@cyberlink.bc.ca] Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 6:47 PM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] ANDREA / My 2 cents "Thus the first ANDREA my players were confronted with was a 50year old man of Italian heritage whose real name was Carmine Sapia, a former mafia leader turned into DG-cleaner [ sorry, Davide for that cliché overkill ;-) ]" Now this is very interesting. I'm always interested in new ways to use la Cosa Nostra. _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Khorne [khorne@cyberlink.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 1:10 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] Why Hasn't Alphonse Gone Insane? "By the time >the cell is nuts enough to decide to throw in their lot against DG nothing >short of an assualt team is likely to take them down." Really. ">The one time I would consider using ANDREA directly against the PC in >question is if you don't think that the player will react well to having >the other players conspire against them. In that case step in as ANDREA >and kill them. That way it's only the GM conspiring against them and they >just have to deal with the loss of the character." And the player will react any better to the GM bumping them off? Once more, I must stress that the game mechanics use for ANDREA that I'm perceiving is as a rather heavy handed 'correction factor' for the way the players are playing. ">But then, if you've killed a school bus full of children to stop the >horror and ANDREA hasn't come a calling, does that mean that you did the >right thing. It must do, unless the people you work for don't care, or are >just as bad as the things you stop, they just hide it better under a >person skin." That's horror. Knowing the corretion is coming mitigates the horror, because you can say "Those ANDREA punishes are the villains." You aren't left to search your own sould and ask yourself "Did I do the right thing?" Instead, your gauge of how far into the abyss you've looked is whether ANDREA visits you or not. You can justify your own behavior "ANDREA hasn't come, so somebody must approve of the earth I scorch." Basically, it prevents the players from examining their own actions and being their own (most likely flawed) moral compass. Instead, ANDREA acts as a sort of beacon they can gauge their actions' 'correctness' against. ">The PCs can and should do whatever they like or need to justify to >themselves that what they're doing is right." But they don't have to in a campaign involving ANDREA. Look, everyone, I'm sorry for going on and on about ANDREA the way I have. It's not very grown up of me, and I apologize for wasting good list time on something this trivial. The idea of ANDREA just seems to bother me. _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Khorne [khorne@cyberlink.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 1:10 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] Why Hasn't Alphonse Gone Insane? "By the time >the cell is nuts enough to decide to throw in their lot against DG nothing >short of an assualt team is likely to take them down." Really. ">The one time I would consider using ANDREA directly against the PC in >question is if you don't think that the player will react well to having >the other players conspire against them. In that case step in as ANDREA >and kill them. That way it's only the GM conspiring against them and they >just have to deal with the loss of the character." And the player will react any better to the GM bumping them off? Once more, I must stress that the game mechanics use for ANDREA that I'm perceiving is as a rather heavy handed 'correction factor' for the way the players are playing. ">But then, if you've killed a school bus full of children to stop the >horror and ANDREA hasn't come a calling, does that mean that you did the >right thing. It must do, unless the people you work for don't care, or are >just as bad as the things you stop, they just hide it better under a >person skin." That's horror. Knowing the corretion is coming mitigates the horror, because you can say "Those ANDREA punishes are the villains." You aren't left to search your own sould and ask yourself "Did I do the right thing?" Instead, your gauge of how far into the abyss you've looked is whether ANDREA visits you or not. You can justify your own behavior "ANDREA hasn't come, so somebody must approve of the earth I scorch." Basically, it prevents the players from examining their own actions and being their own (most likely flawed) moral compass. Instead, ANDREA acts as a sort of beacon they can gauge their actions' 'correctness' against. ">The PCs can and should do whatever they like or need to justify to >themselves that what they're doing is right." But they don't have to in a campaign involving ANDREA. Look, everyone, I'm sorry for going on and on about ANDREA the way I have. It's not very grown up of me, and I apologize for wasting good list time on something this trivial. The idea of ANDREA just seems to bother me. _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of David A. Farnell [1639556911@jcom.home.ne.jp] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 1:49 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] ANDREA From: "The Lizard King" > > to be cheesey! Urban legends are always cheesey! > > It's right about there that I started thinking about Bloody Mary. OK, you're right, there are exceptions. But even most of the Bloody Mary /La Llorona stories are cheesey, although even those are poignant when told by homeless children as part of a nationwide underground culture/religion. Dave _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of David A. Farnell [1639556911@jcom.home.ne.jp] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 1:49 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] ANDREA From: "The Lizard King" > > to be cheesey! Urban legends are always cheesey! > > It's right about there that I started thinking about Bloody Mary. OK, you're right, there are exceptions. But even most of the Bloody Mary /La Llorona stories are cheesey, although even those are poignant when told by homeless children as part of a nationwide underground culture/religion. Dave _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Nick Brownlow [stabernide@netscape.net] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 1:56 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: RE: Re: [DG] (SPOILERS) Human Psychic Ability and Mi-Go <> The MiB broke cover recently to tell everyone on the 7C list that he was still alive, but his silence since then indicates he still hasn't got his PC fixed. Hopefully, this will be remedied soon... __________________________________________________________________ Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas. Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape! http://shopnow.netscape.com/ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Nick Brownlow [stabernide@netscape.net] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 1:56 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: RE: Re: [DG] (SPOILERS) Human Psychic Ability and Mi-Go <> The MiB broke cover recently to tell everyone on the 7C list that he was still alive, but his silence since then indicates he still hasn't got his PC fixed. Hopefully, this will be remedied soon... __________________________________________________________________ Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas. Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape! http://shopnow.netscape.com/ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of David A. Farnell [1639556911@jcom.home.ne.jp] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 2:08 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: MiB and Digest (was [DG] (SPOILERS) Human Psy...) From: "Nick Brownlow" >>> The MiB broke cover recently to tell everyone on the 7C list that he was still alive, but his silence since then indicates he still hasn't got his PC fixed. Hopefully, this will be remedied soon...<<< His PC has been broken for months...I think we'll have to take up a collection. Or we could just send him random parts (without explanation) and hope one fixes the problem. BTW, a welcome to Jeff. The listowner, CO Christopher, recently had this to say when I also asked about a digest version and an improved archive: "I'm looking into automating that process and making it searchable, but I can't give you an estimate on when it might get implemented. Too many other irons in the same crowded fire." So we might get it, but give him some time. Dave _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of David A. Farnell [1639556911@jcom.home.ne.jp] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 2:08 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: MiB and Digest (was [DG] (SPOILERS) Human Psy...) From: "Nick Brownlow" >>> The MiB broke cover recently to tell everyone on the 7C list that he was still alive, but his silence since then indicates he still hasn't got his PC fixed. Hopefully, this will be remedied soon...<<< His PC has been broken for months...I think we'll have to take up a collection. Or we could just send him random parts (without explanation) and hope one fixes the problem. BTW, a welcome to Jeff. The listowner, CO Christopher, recently had this to say when I also asked about a digest version and an improved archive: "I'm looking into automating that process and making it searchable, but I can't give you an estimate on when it might get implemented. Too many other irons in the same crowded fire." So we might get it, but give him some time. Dave _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of dg@fomalhaut.mmcc.monash.edu.au Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 2:54 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] Why Hasn't Alphonse Gone Insane? On Wed, 22 Aug 2001, Khorne wrote: > And the player will react any better to the GM bumping them off? Once more, > I must stress that the game mechanics use for ANDREA that I'm perceiving is > as a rather heavy handed 'correction factor' for the way the players are > playing. > As the player of a character who was shot in the back of the head at point blank range by another character because ANDREA told him that was what he needed to do to sort out the mess they were in, I was extremely angry at the other player for the next five minutes or so, and spent the rest of the session calming down by calling him a "back stabbing mother fucker". I suspect that had an NPC agent shot me, I would have cursed my stupidity for allowing the sneaky bastard to stand behind me, but that would have been the limit of my response. The emotional ties between PCs are far stronger than between a PC and an NPC and so if a trusted PC (or group of PCs) breaches that trust the player feels the effects much more so than if an NPC were to do so. It's just not a good session unless the players want to kill each other afterwards, eh Rob? > That's horror. Knowing the corretion is coming mitigates the horror, > because you can say "Those ANDREA punishes are the villains." But that's the whole point. You don't want the PCs wandering about the place eating babies every chance they get because they can, you want them to eat babies in order to save humanity and to sit there and say, "it was okay to eat those babies, it saved the world, it must've been okay, A Cell still want us around". Of course it mitigates the horror, that's what DG agents do to live with themselves. They come up with excuses as to why what they did wasn't really so bad. In terms of horror value, who cares if some nut case that dips bad people in acid for a living says what you did is okay, it's still horrible. Why doesn't DG collapse seeing as how there are one or two people in the organisation that know everything? because they know too much, and others know too much. MJ-12 know who ALPHONSE is. Why don't they nab him and torture him for all he's worth? Because the next day an assistant director of the FBI is on CNN with proof of MJ-12s existance, or at least they're playing his video last will and testament that got mailed to them by god knows who. If some trashy UFO program on at 11pm on cable starts talking about MJ-12 no-one cares. If two dozen people who all hold important government positions suddenly realise they've got nothing left to lose, and start talking about it, the truth will come out, and MJ-12 don't want that. -- Tim Betz _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of dg@fomalhaut.mmcc.monash.edu.au Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 2:54 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] Why Hasn't Alphonse Gone Insane? On Wed, 22 Aug 2001, Khorne wrote: > And the player will react any better to the GM bumping them off? Once more, > I must stress that the game mechanics use for ANDREA that I'm perceiving is > as a rather heavy handed 'correction factor' for the way the players are > playing. > As the player of a character who was shot in the back of the head at point blank range by another character because ANDREA told him that was what he needed to do to sort out the mess they were in, I was extremely angry at the other player for the next five minutes or so, and spent the rest of the session calming down by calling him a "back stabbing mother fucker". I suspect that had an NPC agent shot me, I would have cursed my stupidity for allowing the sneaky bastard to stand behind me, but that would have been the limit of my response. The emotional ties between PCs are far stronger than between a PC and an NPC and so if a trusted PC (or group of PCs) breaches that trust the player feels the effects much more so than if an NPC were to do so. It's just not a good session unless the players want to kill each other afterwards, eh Rob? > That's horror. Knowing the corretion is coming mitigates the horror, > because you can say "Those ANDREA punishes are the villains." But that's the whole point. You don't want the PCs wandering about the place eating babies every chance they get because they can, you want them to eat babies in order to save humanity and to sit there and say, "it was okay to eat those babies, it saved the world, it must've been okay, A Cell still want us around". Of course it mitigates the horror, that's what DG agents do to live with themselves. They come up with excuses as to why what they did wasn't really so bad. In terms of horror value, who cares if some nut case that dips bad people in acid for a living says what you did is okay, it's still horrible. Why doesn't DG collapse seeing as how there are one or two people in the organisation that know everything? because they know too much, and others know too much. MJ-12 know who ALPHONSE is. Why don't they nab him and torture him for all he's worth? Because the next day an assistant director of the FBI is on CNN with proof of MJ-12s existance, or at least they're playing his video last will and testament that got mailed to them by god knows who. If some trashy UFO program on at 11pm on cable starts talking about MJ-12 no-one cares. If two dozen people who all hold important government positions suddenly realise they've got nothing left to lose, and start talking about it, the truth will come out, and MJ-12 don't want that. -- Tim Betz _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Andy Robertson [andywrobertson@clara.co.uk] Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 10:46 PM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] Why Hasn't Alphonse Gone Insane? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Khorne" To: > > Look, everyone, I'm sorry for going on and on about ANDREA the way I have. I got no complaints. I'm not very grown up neither. Time to put a sock in it now, though :-) The Glove Cleaner ((I always saw ANDREA as a sort of valkerie. Either you fall into the dark when They get you, or, at last, you get a visit from ANDREA. Dark-haired, green-eyed, gentle, the agents's Rest.)) _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Andy Robertson [andywrobertson@clara.co.uk] Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 10:46 PM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] Why Hasn't Alphonse Gone Insane? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Khorne" To: > > Look, everyone, I'm sorry for going on and on about ANDREA the way I have. I got no complaints. I'm not very grown up neither. Time to put a sock in it now, though :-) The Glove Cleaner ((I always saw ANDREA as a sort of valkerie. Either you fall into the dark when They get you, or, at last, you get a visit from ANDREA. Dark-haired, green-eyed, gentle, the agents's Rest.)) _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Jim Clunie [jim_clunie@hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 10:35 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] ANDREA >From: EHuelshoff@t-online.de > > >The first is that the new ANDREA is indeed a woman, a former IRS chick gone >violent. But not with the looks of Andrea Jolie, but more like a mix of >Rosie >O'Donnel and Janeane Garafalo [sp?]. > >Frightening. > Take her character in "Mystery Men" .. combined with, say "The Truth About Cats and Dogs" .. the idea of ANDREA as Janeane Garofalo may just keep me from sleeping tonight. Good choice. >But the second theory is even more frightening! > >Agent ANDREA is in fact > > >[...] > > >[...] > > >[...] > >the woman we know as Nancy Reagan! > Ack! > >eckhard > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of The Nuge [jessthecatasc@oceanfree.net] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 7:11 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com; David A. Farnell Subject: Re: [DG] ANDREA > It's right about there that I started thinking about Bloody Mary. > >OK, you're right, there are exceptions. But even most of the Bloody Mary /La >Llorona stories are cheesey, although even those are poignant when told by >homeless children as part of a nationwide underground culture/religion. Can the Demented Irishman through in his 1 1/2 Pennies (2 cents) about this: mysterious woman, who affects the mentality of the poor, the down-trodden, and the Not-Long-Of-This-World? Theres an Old Irish Legend you may have heard off (what Am I saying? Of course you have!): - The Bean Si. Most likely a derivation of the Morrigan, the Celtic war/death triple goddess that oft appears as a crow, but sometimes as something even more terrible. Visit http://www.oceanfree.net to get your free e-mail account and use our unique Irish Internet directory _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of David A. Farnell [1639556911@jcom.home.ne.jp] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 9:00 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: La Llorona revisited (was Re: [DG] ANDREA) From: "The Nuge" > Theres an Old Irish Legend you may have heard off (what Am I saying? Of course > you have!): > - The Bean Si. Most likely a derivation of the Morrigan, the Celtic war/death > triple goddess that oft appears as a crow, but sometimes as something even more > terrible. Y'know, for a minute there, I was completely stumped and thoroughly irked with myself for not knowing this legend. Then it struck me--you're talking about that babe with the sweet singing voice we call a "banshee" around these parts (OK, not around *these* parts, but around the parts where I come from). Right? Always gotta remind myself to keep those alternate spellings and pronunciation changes in mind. Anyway, yes, I think she fits in very nicely with the La Llorona/Bloody Mary discussion we had a year or so ago. And probably springs from the same dark corner of human fear that spawned the myth about ANDREA. For those who don't know what this is about, see http://www.miaminewtimes.com/issues/1997-06-05/feature.html (Yes, it's still online--in fact, it's been copied to about a dozen other sites. It wasn't just us that it hit a chord with. It's a long read but it's worth it.) And something else: Clive Barker has been inspired to make a movie about it. http://www.clivebarker.dial.pipex.com/newfilmse.html (Scroll about halfway down the page.) Not such a surprise when you consider how his _Candyman_ was based on a very similar urban myth. *** And from the Glovecleaner: > ((I always saw ANDREA as a sort of valkerie. Either you fall into the dark > when They get you, or, at last, you get a visit from ANDREA. Dark-haired, > green-eyed, gentle, the agents's Rest.)) That's lovely. Dave _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Andy Robertson [andywrobertson@clara.co.uk] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 4:46 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: [DG] Rumble http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/vents/nemo/explorer/rumble.html Cute undersea lava flow site, virtual tour. The Glove Cleaner _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Nick Brownlow [stabernide@netscape.net] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 9:35 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: RE: La Llorona revisited (was Re: [DG] ANDREA) Funnily enough, I've been keeping an eye out for La Llorona stuff of late, as I have some vague notion of using her in a story. There's a great article here - http://www.mythology.com/bloodymary.html ...that clues you up on the lineage of the myth, including stuff on the Bean Si/Banshee angle. __________________________________________________________________ Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas. Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape! http://shopnow.netscape.com/ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Nick Brownlow [stabernide@netscape.net] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 9:43 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: RE: Re: [DG] Why Hasn't Alphonse Gone Insane? <> This is a damn shame. __________________________________________________________________ Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas. Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape! http://shopnow.netscape.com/ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Gatten, Marshall [marshall@fusionone.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 10:43 AM To: 'deltagreen@revolutionsf.com' Subject: RE: [DG] ANDREA >As the player of a character who was shot...by another character... I >was extremely angry at the other player for the next five minutes or >so. Had an NPC shot me, I would have cursed my stupidity ... but >that would have been the limit of my response. If a trusted PC >breaches that trust the player feels the effects much more than if an >NPC were to do so. Anybody who takes badly to getting whacked by a fellow agent wouldn't last long in the game I'm in at the moment. In the tower at the Mountains of Madness: Slow down a chasing shoggoth by physically picking up the nearest fellow agent and throwing him at the shoggoth. On the face of a cliff, with one agent climbing a rope to safety: The agent up top intentionally lets go to preserve his own secrets. In the middle of an op Agent Roy gets a phone call from somebody claiming to be agent Richard, while standing right in front of agent Richard who isn't on the phone: Without preamble, while still on the phone, Roy raises his gun and shoots Richard in the face "because Richard's obviously been compromised". I think our group has lost more agents to other agents than we have from all our other encounters put together. And I love it. Knowing that those you are working most closely with, and in whom you entrust your very life, might at any moment send you spiraling into the darkness adds a gritty paranoia that I think is a natural extension of the conspiracy nature of the game. If a cell member gets a call from ANDREA with orders to terminate a member of their cell, they are likely to do it provided that they can prove to themselves that the call actually came from ANDREA. Why are they likely to do it? Because if they fail, they know the next phone call will be to the third agent ordering them to first terminate the primary offender and then to terminate the one who can't follow orders. And then, if THAT order isn't fulfilled, some other cell will receive orders to take out the rogue cell. Which could actually be an interesting story. Your cell is informed that another cell, higher up the ladder but just slightly, has gone rogue. Your cell is ordered to take them out and then continue their mission. You aren't told why. Later, further down the road, your own cell makes the same mistake and becomes the target of another cell and it occurs to you just what that first cell might have done to deserve your bullets. ANDREA gets to stay in the background and clean things anyway. Of course, I also greatly enjoyed the off hand comment somewhere on the list in weeks gone by that ANDREA might actually be a ghoul..... All kinds of fun places you could take that! Marshall From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Jeff Schreier [schreierj@yahoo.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 11:02 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: [DG] Greetings and Questions Thank you, both for the welcome and for the information. Out of curiousity, is the last week a normal week in terms of traffic? Also - do any of you ever have problems with the DG system? We've always run into issues with power levels ... it frequently seems that characters with starting stat packages are too weak and frequently fail at things that they should be able to do - do you just impose large and frequent modifiers to rolls? Or do you up starting stats? Our first solution, which made for a fun but easy game, was to significantly up stats through training (not through the regular method -- just spent time training then adding 2d10 or some such number to the skill) More recently, we converted the game into GURPs .... there is a supplement, Cthulhupunk, which has stats for a lot of the mythos creatures --- and the system has worked fairly well thus far. Any thoughts? Thanks again, Jeff > BTW, a welcome to Jeff. The listowner, CO > Christopher, recently had this to > say when I also asked about a digest version and an > improved archive: > > "I'm looking into automating that process and making > it searchable, but I > can't give you an estimate on when it might get > implemented. Too many other > irons in the same crowded fire." > > So we might get it, but give him some time. > > Dave > > > _______________________________________ > The Delta Green Mailing List > http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Khorne [khorne@cyberlink.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 11:30 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] ANDREA "I think our group has lost more agents to other agents than we have from all our other encounters put together. And I love it. Knowing that those you are working most closely with, and in whom you entrust your very life, might at any moment send you spiraling into the darkness adds a gritty paranoia that I think is a natural extension of the conspiracy nature of the game. " I used to play in a group just like that, back when the SOTA was AD&D. Didn't much care for it, so perhaps this is why the idea of ANDREA bugs me so much. From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Hans-Christian Vortisch [greytiga@zedat.fu-berlin.de] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 11:55 AM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: GURPS and DG (was Re: [DG] Greetings and Questions > More recently, we converted the game into GURPs .... > there is a supplement, Cthulhupunk, which has stats > for a lot of the mythos creatures --- and the system > has worked fairly well thus far. > Very sensible. GURPS is, in my personal opinion, the most useful and best supported game system around. The only thing I kept from CoC is the Sanity - my players love it when the count spirals downwards and downwards - GURPS handles this with Fright Checks, which works, but is far less colourful ... SJG will soon come out with Cops, in which I had a small hand, which should prove useful for DG Keepers. Other good books to plunder are Horror, High-Tech, SPecial Ops, Places of Mystery and a number of other books. I wrote a couple of hardware articles for PYRAMID that might also be interesting, including the upcoming "The Long Arm of the Law - Police Weapons in GURPS, with a Detailed Look at the FBI's Inventory in the 20th-century" Cheers HANS _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Mr. Zero [mrzero@twilite.org] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 12:39 PM To: Delta Green Friendlies Subject: [DG] just a test ..hey I said it was just a test... now ignore those contrails.... sean -- mrzero@twilite.org Homepage: http://www.twilite.org/~mrzero ICQ: 121817936 DG-DarkTide: http://brsp.net/~mrzero "Scotch, straight up, no xeno-linguistic virus. Please." _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Machiavelli132@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 1:47 PM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] Greetings and Questions I find if you keep rolling to a minimum-when the outcome is in jeopardy or uncertain, the skill system works fine. A doctor with 60% in Surgery shouldn't have to roll to perform a routine procedure. _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Gil Trevizo [furrylogic@mindspring.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 2:17 PM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: [DG] Severn Valley Resource Chaosium has sent its Severn Valley sourcebook to the printer (should be available by the end of September), and it's got a great description on the Chaosium site: http://www.chaosium.com/cthulhu/rpg/2393.shtml I was under the impression that it was CoC '20s, but has now been described as very much Modern CoC. I won't bring up the possibilities for conflict with the DG material involving the Campbell Mythos from DG:COUNTDOWN because I already did on Strange-Aeons and got thoroughly flamed for it. Needless to say, it still might very well be compatible and if it isn't, it's probably still a solid piece of work. Suprisingly enough for Chaosium, the preview artwork doesn't look like the work of a five-year old with a crayon. Gil _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Khorne [khorne@cyberlink.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 3:49 PM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: GURPS and DG (was Re: [DG] Greetings and Questions ">Very sensible. GURPS is, in my personal opinion, the most useful and best >supported game system around." I'm very interested to hear this, since my own enquiries have led me to consider the game mechanics of call of Cthulhu the most versatile around. They accept expansion and modification easily where necessary, and are very "quick and dirty". perhaps I should give GURPS another look. "The only thing I kept from CoC is the Sanity - >my players love it when the count spirals downwards and downwards - GURPS >handles this with Fright Checks, which works, but is far less colourful ..." The original CoC Sanity system wasn't the best, but as envisioned in the most recent set of rules, its sublime. _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Khorne [khorne@cyberlink.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 3:51 PM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: Re: [DG] Severn Valley Resource And even if there are conflicts, they should be easily dealt with...secret histories versus what the general public knows and all that. Chaosium produces such solid product that I can think of no reason not to get this one, anyway. "I won't bring up the possibilities for conflict >with the DG material involving the Campbell Mythos from DG:COUNTDOWN >because I already did on Strange-Aeons and got thoroughly flamed for >it. Needless to say, it still might very well be compatible and if it >isn't, it's probably still a solid piece of work." _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/ From: owner-deltagreen@revolutionsf.com on behalf of Marc J Cassell [nekonube2k@juno.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 4:23 PM To: deltagreen@revolutionsf.com Subject: [DG] Fw: [jasfa] Ken Talton has sent you an article from thescotsman.co.uk I got sent this from another list I am on, and well it just seemed odd. Anyone got any takes on this? Iceweb http://www.thescotsman.co.uk - Scotland's best selling quality national newspaper. -------------------------------- Ken's message: Ewww! -------------------------------- A 64-year-old man lies dead for a year and no-one raises the alarm In the smart ground-floor flat just off Glasgow's Sauchiehall Street, they finally discovered Yuk Kueng Ling. He had lain there for eight months, while his six children and his neighbours went about their everyday business, oblivious. His family had last been in contact late last year, while those living in the same building had barely spoken to the "wee Chinese man" during the nine years since he arrived there. They passed his front door daily, where police discovered his badly decomposed body this month. He was 64. Tom Gordon and James Doherty Wednesday, 22 August 2001 The Scotsman -------------------------------- To read the full article with its related links and pictures go to: http://thescotsman.co.uk/index.cfm?id=101118 This article cannot be reproduced without permission. ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. _______________________________________ The Delta Green Mailing List http://www.delta-green.com/comint/dgml/